Resist_The_Dawn

Join Date 03/2009

Command and Conquer 4

Got accepted to the beta the other day, and I hafta say that I actually like it. I was afraid that it would suck, and there are elements of it I dont like, but once you get into it its alot of fun.

Now I know lot of people are pissed off cause they changed the formula, but honestly, the formula needs to be changed, CnC has been the same game with new graphics for like 15 years now. I wouldnt want to see all RTS' turn into this one, but it's nice for a change of pace.

Now that I have that out of the way, my thoughts on the game itself.I'm not going to go in depth into game mechanics and such because you can just read a preview for that, I'm just gonna talk about things that I find interesting/good/bad

-The matches are extremely short, most not lasting longer than 15 minutes. I view this as a plus because I dont always have time for 3 hour battles.

-Engineers. Both factions have multiple types of engineers who autoheal any units taht are damaged within their heal range. These are are good as you don't have to micromanage them when things get damaged, just stick them next to your units and let them do their thing. The problem with these that I've seen happen a few times is the engineer spam. One player will spend their entire pop cap (More on that in a second) on engineers or their flying variants and make an army almost invincible. I havn't figured out an effective counter for this yet, as attacking the engineers wont work because they'll heal each other as ssoon as they take damage.

-population cap. It goes down the more players are in the game, with a full 5 on 5 giving you enough space for an average of 10-12 units. This is the only thing that limits you from getting more units as you don't hafta spend tiberium to get them, it just takes time.

-Persistence. This is the worst thing about the game. When you start youre stuck at level 1 for each faction until you rank up. Level 1 gives you about 3 units, and no research. THIS SUCKS! I just got my nod to level 7 and I finally got to the 2nd tier of stuff. This is way worse than the minor buffs that most games with persistence give you, this is like forcing the new players to get destroyed. Nevermind the fact they don't know how to play the game, They also dont get any of the research buffs or better units or anything. Absolutely horrible call.

That's all I can think of for now, what does everyone think? Does everyone hate this because of the new playstyle? Or just because EA is making us stay online to play even singleplayer? I'm not sure if I'll buy it because of EA's retarded DRM but I like this game so much at the moment I might have to.

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-Persistence. This is the worst thing about the game. When you start youre stuck at level 1 for each faction until you rank up. Level 1 gives you about 3 units, and no research. THIS SUCKS! I just got my nod to level 7 and I finally got to the 2nd tier of stuff. This is way worse than the minor buffs that most games with persistence give you, this is like forcing the new players to get destroyed. Nevermind the fact they don't know how to play the game, They also dont get any of the research buffs or better units or anything. Absolutely horrible call.

This is quite possibly the most stupid idea I've heard of in an RTS. No, scratch that, it IS the most stupid idea. What joy long time players will have when they get a newb on their team who not only doesn't fully understand any of the strategies, but is limited to tier 1 units regardless of how well they can play! Fully upgraded Mammoth Tanks coming at you? Well too bad, you only get light tanks to fight them with! *Facepalms*

But then, this coming from the company that thought Battleforge was a good idea for a RTS.

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looks atrocious.

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I tried it. I'm not a fan. I really do like the standard formula, and CNC was one of the few series that, up until this point, didn't fetishize change.

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They honestly should have put the main C&C on hold and made Generals 2.

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The game gets really boring.

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Doesn't sound like the sort of thing I'd enjoy, I like the resource side of games. Seems like all the ones that had any resource management are being changed though - supcom is to have a simplified economy, C&C is to have no economy (if I've read the OP correctly), DoW2 had no economy...

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@aeortar yea thats correct, there is absolutely no economy. I did just find out though that the persistence thing carries over from the campaign to multiplayer, so all the noobs will have played a bit of the campaign first before going into multi, so it's not all bad heh.

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(Yeah, late post. I know.)

Well, I personally only play the campaign, but this COULD get me to venture into multiplayer occasionally just for the hell of it.

I mean I can understand if the only reason they did it is to make people want to try new things. It sounds interesting. I won't be sure whether or not I'll like it until I try it.

I do know the old C&C style was getting dull. At some point I suppose the decision is fun games that nobody plays much of because they've played them before, or a chance at revitalization that could end in catastrophic failure.

I consider Dawn of War 2 a catastrophic failure, but I still want to play C&C4.

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This game just sounds worse and worse the more I hear about it.

-The matches are extremely short, most not lasting longer than 15 minutes. I view this as a plus because I dont always have time for 3 hour battles.
15 minute games? I seriously hope you're stretching things here for effect. Games of CnC3 lasted around 30 minutes, and felt perfect despite the fact that the game was utter trash. Shortening the game further to 15 minutes just shows how disconnected they've become from whats left of their fan base. How about they just make a 2D version of the game using Java and release it on Facebook?

-Engineers. Both factions have multiple types of engineers who autoheal any units taht are damaged within their heal range. These are are good as you don't have to micromanage them when things get damaged, just stick them next to your units and let them do their thing. The problem with these that I've seen happen a few times is the engineer spam. One player will spend their entire pop cap (More on that in a second) on engineers or their flying variants and make an army almost invincible. I havn't figured out an effective counter for this yet, as attacking the engineers wont work because they'll heal each other as ssoon as they take damage.
The game is in Beta right now, so I'll just assume this glaringly amateur design choice and terrible execution will be corrected before retail.

-population cap. It goes down the more players are in the game, with a full 5 on 5 giving you enough space for an average of 10-12 units. This is the only thing that limits you from getting more units as you don't hafta spend tiberium to get them, it just takes time.
So they're optimising the PC version for the 360 release? Seriously, unless you're pumping out Supreme Commander levels of units this is a terrible idea that has no place on the PC save to ensure it can run on much lesser levels of hardware to maximise sales... which is a pointless endeavour; EA's name on the box costs them sales, their DRM will cost them sales, the fact that they've driven the grand-daddy of RTSs into the ground will cost them sales and the sure-to-be-bad release reviews will cost them sales.

-Persistence. This is the worst thing about the game. When you start youre stuck at level 1 for each faction until you rank up. Level 1 gives you about 3 units, and no research. THIS SUCKS! I just got my nod to level 7 and I finally got to the 2nd tier of stuff. This is way worse than the minor buffs that most games with persistence give you, this is like forcing the new players to get destroyed. Nevermind the fact they don't know how to play the game, They also dont get any of the research buffs or better units or anything. Absolutely horrible call.
Saw this coming a mile away.

That's all I can think of for now, what does everyone think?
I think EA have destroyed one of gamings iconic franchises and are simply beating a dead horse for whatever money they can squeeze out of it.

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@Zehdon- In retrospect, I disagree with most of the things I said in the OP. But FYI there is no 360 Release. When I made this thread it had been a long time since I had played a REAL game of CnC, and recently have been playing various games of more classic Command and conquers and red alerts and what not, and I gotta say I just wont enjoy this game now. Small unit sizes no economy and just about no strategy is quite boring now IMO.

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Quoting ZehDon,

reply 10

I think EA have destroyed one of gamings iconic franchises and are simply beating a dead horse for whatever money they can squeeze out of it.

Considering whats left of the C&C team is supposedly being axed after this game, I doubt EA has any expectations of it selling well. I doubt C&C3 or RA3 sold great either, so the remake was necessary.

I will just remain hopeful for the SP campaign. IMO the entire main C&C series bombed after the first game...and Red Alert is still going strong.

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Right, so Red Alert didn't suck ass after RA3? Technically RA3 shouldn't exist. The events in the Red Alert series happened because Einstein went back in time to kill Hitler. However, in the intro cutscene of RA3, the Soviets go back in time to kill Einstein. Since Einstein was killed, that means he couldn't go back in time to kill Hitler, meaning WWII should have happened as normal since Hitler was alive to create Nazi Germany.

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That depends which theory you agree with. My opinion is that WW2 DID happen, and that timeline did exist, though Einstein went back to change it (creating an alternate timeline.)

Otherwise, you'd be in your own paradox where he went back in time to kill someone who never existed.

At any rate, I was under the impression the Russian docs work was based on Einsteins technology...so this would've happened at the proper time.

There isn't anything after RA3 so I couldn't tell you if it sucked ass after RA3 (and yes, I know what you meant and I'm being an ass, I liked RA3 and bought two copies to play it with my bro. I didn't buy it for around six months just because I didn't expect much after C&C3.)

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