Economic Treaties

Howdy all,

I'm wondering if anyone knows of any ways to make civs more likely to trade economic treaties.

I seem to find that while I get everyone's research treaties; I never have enough cash/technology to get economic treaties from anyone (even piling in all the cash and techs I have results in a red response).

I doubt I am any kind of economy expert; that said I virtually never have economy problems (usually stabilise my economy before my starting cash runs out).

A few items that may be relevant...

- I tend to get to Republic and the first diplomacy tech quickly

- I tend to be the most advanced (i.e. most research) civ in the game (since I usually run 20/20/60 all of the game)

- Even "warm" plus civs seem to value their economic treaties absurdly high

- I usually play on a couple of notches up from normal difficulty (I can't recall off-hand the name of the difficulty level)

If anyone has any suggestions or an insight as to how the value of the treaty is calculated (to the AI) they would be greatly appreciated.

Franbo

PS. It's not that big a deal, I win anyway, but it annoys me a little bit

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There was a restriction put in a while back where the AI was very unwilling to trade away its economic treaty before I believe it was the third year.

Some people have said they won't do it, period, but the simple fact of the matter is it's just horrendously expensive. In my experience, it's been in the realm of about 50k BC during the first year or two, and I have seen this increase at least as high as 70K fairly early on as well. Presumably the AI continues to increase its perceived value of its economic treaty as its economy improves, and then at some point (3 year mark, or thereabouts) it re-values it under a new system, which it then uses for (what should be) the rest of the game.

The AI does however value your treaties fairly highly-I've managed to get an economic treaty off of an AI in the first year for my econ+research treaties and some cash, if memory serves. Though I don't remember how much money was included in the deal, I'm positive it was a lot. Obviously enough, however, I could only pull that off once, having only one of each treaty to trade away.

As for why piling techs into the trade isn't helping-the AI values bundles of techs lower than the sum of the individual techs, but almost invariably more than the greatest tech. The more you add into the trade, whether it's techs, planets, ships, etc, the less the AI will value each individual component. Interestingly, the AI does not seem to do this nearly as much on its side of the trade screen.

Basically all I can suggest is that you play longer/larger games, and get more of an economy going. And don't worry too much about the 20,000BC income penalty.

And my apologies for not having a formula for how much a treaty is worth to an AI.

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Ahh, if they value it anywhere near 50k that would be why I've almost never managed to acquire one. By the time I have that much "spare" cash it's too late in the game to care about buying any loose treaties (I can always think of better ways to spend that kind of money than for a treaty).

I've managed to snag a treaty when I offer mine in exchange, however that only applies to a single AI.

I tend to treat treaties (both types) as a means to bolster friendliness with the AI (so that I can control when we go to war) rather than to augment my own research/economy.

For this purpose; unless I can get the treaties fairly early in the game there isn't much point (by the time I could afford anywhere near 50k I am likely winning overwhelmingly anyway).

Thanks for the answer, that was exactly the kind of thing I was looking for (a "guesstimate" value is more useful than a formula in this instance), very helpful.

Franbo

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