Why the MV League is an interesting alternative to the MV.

And it's high score big, long games...

from GalCiv2 Forums
Hi all,

Firstly, i am a Metaverse player and i love it. I play exclusively in the MV and wish i had only done so sooner. I am a member of the MV Council and the emperor of a prominent MV empire. I also was one of many that helped create the Metaverse League (MVL) and it's administrator. So please do not think i am shining a negative light onto the MV in any way. Simply not true. I just wish to highlight some interesting points. (and plug the MVL along the way)

So all that aside, why do i think that the MVL is a interesting alternative to the MV?

Score.

Now don't get me wrong i play those high score big long games and i too wish my name was "up in lights" as one of the top ranked 25 players, a goal i still aspire to. The nice medal that goes along with it would be nice too.
But is being ranked on your score the only way to judge your games and your skill in them?

Some newer players may and do find it most difficult to compete with the top 25. I know i do. I might win a game, but how can i compete, scoring games that are many hundreds of thousands lower in score? How can a new player compete against the top players and feel satisfied with their game? And win?

The Metaverse League.

The MVL does not care about your big high score, in a sense. You can be rewarded for it yes, but will it provide you with a win? No.

You see the MVL plays rounds, much like your local football league might. We have teams, captains, rules and rounds. Each round has a particular challenge that must be completed. It might be a conquest victory or a influence victory in a medium galaxy. A tech victory in a tiny galaxy or like our most recent round a diplomatic victory.

As a team member you are assigned to win. Nothing else.

There are bonus points available in various categories so certain strategies are required but the biggest reward you can can give your team is to win.

Think about it, it really is an interesting thought. For instance, a new player could play only in smaller maps and never get a high score but still best some of the game veterans or better yet, a top 25 player.

Our most recent round for instance, Metaverse League Round 4 had one very interesting outcome along these very lines that prompted me to write this. Notwithstanding being a really fun and rewarding round, the team with the highest score, did not win!!

Yes, that's right, having scored the highest scores did not guarantee that team victory. There were many factors in play of which i won't get into here (come and join to find out why & how) but in the end having that big score did not get the job done.

Of course there are players in the community, reading this post now even, that can, at will it seems, continue to play those monster high score games. Can playing in the league get you to rank higher or as high as those players?
No, of cousre not.
But playing in the League's smaller games, that do not take weeks to complete nor they do not require the most intimate knowledge of the mechanics of the game to compete successfully, may leave you satisfied and with a win, a win over a big name player no less.

I of course like many other League players, still play those big long games that seem to take months to complete. By the end of those games i am exhausted and could not consider starting another one anytime soon.

The win, though i did achieve it is not satisfying and nor in the end fun. And maybe i made a dent in the top 25, if i was lucky.

Now, what is the point of winning games if they are not fun? Yes the big score is a reward in and of itself, but is that all there is to winning, the score?

The Metaverse League. Is it an alternative to the big game high score MV....

You bet!
Come and check us out......

Neilo,
Commissioner MV League.
Emperor Tyranny of Evil.

"The Metaverse League"
Player Sign up & Roster
Round Results & League Ladder
MVL Rulebook
The MVL and the AltMeta
metaverse
10,350 views 16 replies
Reply #1 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Bravo! This might actually spread the name. Well done, my friend.

As for adding my reason for liking the MVL(this is just one among others):

Different style of play:
We've never once gotten the settings that we would usually play in. So, basically, it challenges you to play an unfimiliar setup and all the while compete with other players in performance on that particular setting. In fact, here you can challenge the all time #1 champion of the Metaverse: Mumblefratz(also a great benefactor to the league and the rulekeeper).

-Fire
Vice Comissioner
Senior member, Hitchhiker Empire.
#12 at the Altmeta.  ;) 
  
Reply #2 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
HAHA you bet, and unfortunately, the top MV player went down in a ball of flames. Sorry Mumble, Oh I'm gonna get it now. Vengence will be his.

Well written Neilo.
SoundPackager - Customize the Windows sound scheme
Reply #3 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
good stuff from our intrepid commissioner!

i hope it's not stepping out of bounds if i add a few points not covered.

the Metaverse League ("MVL") is really about more than just playing GC2. there are some features neilo didn't touch on that i think are remarkable.

the MVL is about commaradarie. i wouldn't normally call people i meet on the internet, whose faces i've never see, friends. but i'd call my fellow MV-leaguers friends. teams throw insults at each other, but it's all in good fun. everyone gets to boast because everyone has something to be proud of. even though each round has its winning team and shinning games, i think the only losers are the ones who walk away from the league for good. completing a game on mostly random settings, with goals in mind that might not line up to a high metaverse score, is a challenge, and everyone in the league seems to recognize that. we congratulate all our players, and while there's a fair amount of friendly competition between teams, it's always more friendly than competative.

the MVL can teach you a lot about GC2. when you join an empire, you might start learning some "in house secrets" from that league's more prestigious players. in the MVL, you might find yourself playing alongside a teammate from a rival empire. you might learn a few tricks you wouldn't get if you just stick to that empire. you'll also definately play games that you'd never play otherwise. the greatest enhancement to my ability to play GC2 has come from the MVL. becuase i'm not facing the same challenge constantly, i've learned the game better than i would have. i play alongside players from all the most successful empires. i trade strategies with my team mates, and they trade back. and i think those are skills i can turn around and use on those gigantic (and now immense), all-abundant suicidal games--not that i play on suicidal much, but now that i'm learning so much, it doesn't feel so far off.

the MVL is democratic. while we might not re-invent our proverbial wheel every time a new player enters our ranks, we encourage discussion and input from all players when we make changes. it can indeed be tedious, but those are useful skills to have (...get ready for it...) for life in general. as shocking as it is, yes, this is another example of a way a video game can help you succeed in life. but that's not a big selling point. the real issue here is that you're not at the arbitrary whims of a set of developers who decided "this constitutes the most most important factor in winning." you can help make the rules in the MVL, and that's a really rewarding feeling (win or lose).

finally, you can decide how committed you will be to the MVL. if you're kind of curious and think you'd like to try a round, you're welcome to do so. if you find yourself in a period of time that won't allow you to play much GC2, that's fine! all we ask is that you remain in communication with your team, and we'll deal. some MV leaguers play several games in a round and select the best one as their official submission. many MV leaguers sit a round out here or there. the only reason to play is enjoyment of GC2 and all the variety the game can present, and the only things at stake in the MVL are bragging rights and your own potential desire to become a better player.

haunt our forums if you're still not sure. we won't hold it againt you. some of us chat up a storm, and others only stop in here and there, to post their games and check in. you don't even have to wait for a new round to start! we'll be happy to accept you mid-round, and the only truly bad time to start is in the last couple days of a round (and that's really only for your own benefit as much as anything).

so, i hope my own small contributions can help round out the picture of the MVL that neilo painted in his original post. we're a fun lot, and we'd love to have more players. after all, we've only got five teams, A through E, and there are still 21 letters left to go in the alphabet :D 
Reply #4 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

good stuff from our intrepid commissioner!

i hope it's not stepping out of bounds if i add a few points not covered.

the Metaverse League ("MVL") is really about more than just playing GC2. there are some features neilo didn't touch on that i think are remarkable.

the MVL is about commaradarie. i wouldn't normally call people i meet on the internet, whose faces i've never see, friends. but i'd call my fellow MV-leaguers friends. teams throw insults at each other, but it's all in good fun. everyone gets to boast because everyone has something to be proud of. even though each round has its winning team and shinning games, i think the only losers are the ones who walk away from the league for good. completing a game on mostly random settings, with goals in mind that might not line up to a high metaverse score, is a challenge, and everyone in the league seems to recognize that. we congratulate all our players, and while there's a fair amount of friendly competition between teams, it's always more friendly than competative.

the MVL can teach you a lot about GC2. when you join an empire, you might start learning some "in house secrets" from that league's more prestigious players. in the MVL, you might find yourself playing alongside a teammate from a rival empire. you might learn a few tricks you wouldn't get if you just stick to that empire. you'll also definately play games that you'd never play otherwise. the greatest enhancement to my ability to play GC2 has come from the MVL. becuase i'm not facing the same challenge constantly, i've learned the game better than i would have. i play alongside players from all the most successful empires. i trade strategies with my team mates, and they trade back. and i think those are skills i can turn around and use on those gigantic (and now immense), all-abundant suicidal games--not that i play on suicidal much, but now that i'm learning so much, it doesn't feel so far off.

the MVL is democratic. while we might not re-invent our proverbial wheel every time a new player enters our ranks, we encourage discussion and input from all players when we make changes. it can indeed be tedious, but those are useful skills to have (...get ready for it...) for life in general. as shocking as it is, yes, this is another example of a way a video game can help you succeed in life. but that's not a big selling point. the real issue here is that you're not at the arbitrary whims of a set of developers who decided "this constitutes the most most important factor in winning." you can help make the rules in the MVL, and that's a really rewarding feeling (win or lose).

finally, you can decide how committed you will be to the MVL. if you're kind of curious and think you'd like to try a round, you're welcome to do so. if you find yourself in a period of time that won't allow you to play much GC2, that's fine! all we ask is that you remain in communication with your team, and we'll deal. some MV leaguers play several games in a round and select the best one as their official submission. many MV leaguers sit a round out here or there. the only reason to play is enjoyment of GC2 and all the variety the game can present, and the only things at stake in the MVL are bragging rights and your own potential desire to become a better player.

haunt our forums if you're still not sure. we won't hold it againt you. some of us chat up a storm, and others only stop in here and there, to post their games and check in. you don't even have to wait for a new round to start! we'll be happy to accept you mid-round, and the only truly bad time to start is in the last couple days of a round (and that's really only for your own benefit as much as anything).

so, i hope my own small contributions can help round out the picture of the MVL that neilo painted in his original post. we're a fun lot, and we'd love to have more players. after all, we've only got five teams, A through E, and there are still 21 letters left to go in the alphabet  
End of quote


Well said, Dystopic. :)
Reply #5 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I'm a MVLer. I've played that last 2 rounds and it's been a blast. You certainly do pick up a lot of tips. This last round I felt the need to step up my game. With the help of my teammates I managed to get a suicidal victory. I tip my hat to Dystopic and FireBender. The MVL has certainly helped me really learn the game and step up my level of play.
Reply #6 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
The MVL is the reason I play Metaverse games since I personally tend to like to create stories with my games so most of my sandbox games are heavily modded. The biggest selling point to me IS the camaraderie by far, it is definitely a group of amazing individuals.

I usually tell people that the most basic goals of the Metaverse League are 1) TO HAVE FUN! 2) to improve a player's gaming ability 3) TO HAVE FUN 4) to challenge a player into trying out new ideas, tactics, and styles 5) TO HAVE FUN 6) To play outside one's comfort zone and 7) to have FUN of course!!!

I've played the last two rounds, I've been on the winning team, and I've been on the losing team, but in both cases I had a heck of a good time.

The best advice I can give to those that are curious about the MVL is just ASK questions, we will be glad to include you.

It really is a fun way to play Galactic Civilizations (and for the record, to new players that are wondering, we include set up for both DL and DA, and TA once it comes out; so there is no need to feel like you have to play a certain version of the game to compete)
Reply #7 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Good points all.

Although I wouldn't say that the MVL is an alternative to the MV, to me it's more of an extension of the metaverse.
Reply #8 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
agreed, though Neilo did tell me he was pretty much asleep when he wrote this
Reply #9 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
*applauds*

Congrats on an excellent start to the season guys, and on another excellent thread :D
Reply #10 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
and on another excellent thread
End of quote


now on to hurling insults! :LOL: 
Reply #11 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Well said, all.

Another aspect of the MVL that appeals to me is the real threat of a lost/incomplete game or incorrect win, which the last round hammered home nicely. It puts a different spin on the game and raises the challenge.

As far as hurling insults goes, I think we've moved beyond that. It's a simple matter of predetermination that all will bow down to Team E in this next round. (That is, unless PlayJeff has any more bribes to offer. That Rye Whiskey he found for round 4 is gone and I might need a refill. Same address.  ;)  )

Reply #12 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Well said, all.

Another aspect of the MVL that appeals to me is the real threat of a lost/incomplete game or incorrect win, which the last round hammered home nicely. It puts a different spin on the game and raises the challenge.

As far as hurling insults goes, I think we've moved beyond that. It's a simple matter of predetermination that all will bow down to Team E in this next round. (That is, unless PlayJeff has any more bribes to offer. That Rye Whiskey he found for round 4 is gone and I might need a refill. Same address.    )

End of quote


I guess Mumble got his as well
Reply #13 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Our most recent round for instance, Metaverse League Round 4 had one very interesting outcome along these very lines that prompted me to write this. Notwithstanding being a really fun and rewarding round, the team with the highest score, did not win!!
End of quote


In fact, the team with the lowest average score took the win for Round 4. We discussed, strategized, and worked together as a team to devise a new path to victory. Our diabolical cunning trumped the brute strength of mega-scores, and the Domination of Death sits at the top of the league...for now. ;)

The MVL is definitely an interesting and fun alternative to the Metaverse rankings.

Kzinti empire2.JPG Sentient species taste better...
Reply #14 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Good points all.

Although I wouldn't say that the MVL is an alternative to the MV, to me it's more of an extension of the metaverse.
End of quote


Indeed, and Kzinti just put it a little better, Alternative Metaverse rankings, describes my thoughts a little better.
Reply #15 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Taken from the current MVL Round 5 thread



Reply • Quote
(Diplomat)Iztok Bitenc
December 13, 2007 05:15:19
Reply #76
Hi!
We are after an Influence Victory in a Tiny Galaxy with 4 Opponents.

Settings are,
Habitable planets - Abundant
...
Allow Surrenders


Some random thoughts.

Pitty the "judge/jury" can't create a game, post it on the net, and let others battle it out. Or maybe he coud? But then he'd need to manually check each of those 20+ finished games. Too much of work?

Why there's no difficulty level specified? When the prime source of points is a victory/defeat type, then playing suicidal doesn't make sense. Why don't you assign more points for the difficulty: like 1 for maso, 2 for obscene, 3 for suicidal (-1 for cakewalk?)

There's no scores for game version. To my experience DA is significantly harder than DL. You may consider giving some revard for winning a DA game.

Winning with some races is significantly easier than with others. Maybe add a rule no race can be used twice in a team, or a revard for playing "underdogs" like Iconian.

BR, Iztok
[Fleet Captain] [5 Game Winner] [20 Game Winner] [Thalan] [Over 15 Battles] [Chaotic Evil] [Masochistic]



We've had already many responses that answer Iztok's questions and ruminations. But I thought this thread may be a good place to add something to that.

Mumblefratz said it when he responded that we didn't want to be an "experts" only club. I've always kinda looked at the MVL as a neighborhood game of baseball, we're not the pros or anything, just a random group of people that are having fun together for the love of a game.

I want the MVL to be there and a completely new person to the game to come in, and say "hey, this looks like it could be fun" and join in; and not have them intimidated by feeling they can't accomplish or compete with the others.

And I'm glad that we give out rewards for various accomplishments. I know that while I can manage ok scores in my games I can't compete, score-wise, with some of the other players. I can however win my games very fast and still manage to get a good score.

I like how we make people think outside the box so to speak; its not all about conquest on these gigantic maps to see who can get the highest score. Its more nuanced, score is a part of it but just having high scores will not guarantee you or your team a win; actually in the last round the team with the LOWEST average score actually took first place.

I really really suggest that anyone that is even thinking or has thought about trying out a MVL game to stop by and do it. Talk to us, let us know what your thinking, that maybe the MVL is or isn't for you so you just want to try it out for one round; and hey, thats cool, we can work something out for you.

We are extremely lucky to have individuals that are very knowledgeable and helpful, and also considerate, honorable, and open to new things.

I guess all I can say, again, is that anyone that's ever thought about trying out one of our League games to just stop by, drop us a note, and get in for the action; EVEN if its only for that one round. We are here not only for our own enjoyment but to give others another possibly way to enjoy an already very enjoyable game.
Reply #16 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Pitty the "judge/jury" can't create a game, post it on the net, and let others battle it out. Or maybe he coud? But then he'd need to manually check each of those 20+ finished games. Too much of work?
End of quote


you know, i think some of this is going to be made possible in TA without manual checking. i don't have a link handy, and i'm heading out the door right after i shave (really, i swear, i'm going). will check back tomorrow.