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MVL Round 4 Draft and Discussion

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Neilo
dystopic
Join Date 10/2005
+41
Reply #151 November 12, 2007 12:47:36 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
i completed a game, and i'm mostly satisfied with it. if i enjoyed this round's settings a bit more, i'd probably try to do better.

as for chatting and such, i do a great deal of that from work, but i've been swamped for the last two weeks (single-handedly editing a 270-page anthology of student essays). most of my free time i've spent 1) de-stressing, 2) beta-testing TA, and 3) continuing to work on my racial victory medal.

you know, it's too bad there's no way to move on to the next round, or even play another game under different rules for this round. at one point i'd considered suggesting some kind of relay or triathalon type rule. either, in the case of a relay, 4 different map settings that individual team members must complete (one map per player) in a particular order, or several different map settings that each player must complete (each player plays 3 games). but obviously both of these ideas present problems to RL time constraints.
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Neilo
Neilo
Join Date 04/2006
+128
Reply #152 November 19, 2007 5:20:43 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
Please check out this thread guys, The MVL and the AltMeta, we have been trying to get the MVL into the AltMeta for a while and now we are finally on the road to do this. We do need your support though. It will not be a quick and easy process for Kryo but he is willing to do this if there is the support to go with it. Please drop by this thread and lend your support to this effort.
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Neilo
KzintiPatriarch
Join Date 05/2007
+95
Reply #153 November 20, 2007 6:18:47 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
several different map settings that each player must complete (each player plays 3 games).


This is a very interesting idea. Has there been any real consideration to having a round like this?

Kzinti empire2.JPG Sentient species taste better...

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Neilo
dystopic
Join Date 10/2005
+41
Reply #154 November 20, 2007 6:55:39 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
several different map settings that each player must complete (each player plays 3 games).
This is a very interesting idea. Has there been any real consideration to having a round like this?


well, that was the first time i raised the idea, and AFAIK it hadn't come up before. perhaps if there is enough interest we could give it more consideration.
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Neilo
Neilo
Join Date 04/2006
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Reply #155 November 25, 2007 12:55:28 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
Interesting idea, Dystopic. I had a somewhat similar idea a while ago and i have not bothered to bring it up as i think it will be shot down, though i think the idea is great.

It only involves one game but a game played by all members of the team. The settings would be on a bigger map than we play and each player would play the game for a set amount of game time (2 yrs for instance) then email the save file to the next team member.

I know this needs alot of thought still but you get the basic idea. 1 game played by all members of the team.

Well i though it sounded good....
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Neilo
DethAdder
Join Date 02/2004
+73
Reply #156 November 25, 2007 1:03:01 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
That actually sounds like it could be a lot of fun and would require some good team communication to manage and advance the game in the proper fashion. As you played you would essentially need to tell and show if you could with screenies what you were doing and your overall plan to your teamates and get feedback and advice while each member played. hhhmmm. PBEM except your playing the same side, what a concept .
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Neilo
dystopic
Join Date 10/2005
+41
Reply #157 November 25, 2007 1:07:34 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
that is another interesting idea! how would you pick the difficulty level? average difficulty of the team? lowest? i suppose confirmation that the game was handed off could have to be on the honor's system, not that we seem to have a problem with that. it'd definately mix things up!
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Neilo
Neilo
Join Date 04/2006
+128
Reply #158 November 25, 2007 1:26:10 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
As you played you would essentially need to tell and show if you could with screenies what you were doing and your overall plan to your teamates and get feedback and advice while each member played.


Exactly, and i could not think of a better way to get better at the game. For instance, i cannot get a start playing on suicidal, but mid to late in the game (a gig abundant all for eg) the AI are far to weak for me. That is on challenging and tough. With this concept, a game could be played on the harder levels and someone like me could play a few years after a suicidal player.

What a way to further your own game play.....

That actually sounds like it could be a lot of fun and would require some good team communication to manage and advance the game in the proper fashion.


Right. In my mind i even had thoughts of whilst someone was playing you might be on chat (irc, yahoo, msn...whatever) and getting up to date tips and advice from team mates.....That's abit of a stretch i know, but the possibilities are interesting.

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Neilo
Neilo
Join Date 04/2006
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Reply #159 November 25, 2007 1:41:30 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
how would you pick the difficulty level? average difficulty of the team? lowest? i suppose confirmation that the game was handed off could have to be on the honor's system, not that we seem to have a problem with that. it'd definately mix things up!


Average difficulty of the team would seem to be the better choice. Personally i would love to do this way above my normal level. As i said above, my problem is at the start of the game, toward the end it is far too easy.

As for the handing off of the game, yeah the honour system would be fine, like you say, we seem to have had no issues with that system so far.

One concern would be that the whole team would obviously have to have the same game. DL, DA, TA and the same version, but that would be easy enough, everyone at the very least has the latest DL.
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Neilo
DethAdder
Join Date 02/2004
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Reply #160 November 25, 2007 1:59:38 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
You know I think this idea is so cool, Maybe about four of us could get together and try this as a side thing and a test of how someting like this would go.

For instance, i cannot get a start playing on suicidal, but mid to late in the game (a gig abundant all for eg) the AI are far to weak for me.


Yea I know I've tried a couple of times and a bad start means the mid to late game comes far too early and doesn't end well for me   
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Neilo
Neilo
Join Date 04/2006
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Reply #161 November 25, 2007 2:28:45 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
You know I think this idea is so cool, Maybe about four of us could get together and try this as a side thing and a test of how someting like this would go.


I'm keen. Perhaps a few other are interested.
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Neilo
FireBender
Join Date 10/2006
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Reply #162 November 25, 2007 3:45:28 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums

You know I think this idea is so cool, Maybe about four of us could get together and try this as a side thing and a test of how someting like this would go.


Make that five!

Of course, there are still points to be taken into consideration.
First, suppose that the average team difficulty is crippling and we're playing a medium map with 9 opponents.

Dystopic starts and gets a nice colonization phase going. Then its DA's turn. DA gets a few AI under his thumb. Then its off to neilo who builds multiple Military SB arrays and goes ethical alignment to EVIL   and builds the famed MCC. Then its off to me and I do what DA did. Then its off to Mumble. Mumble wins with a year to spare but someone still has a turn left. So mumble replays it and manages to not win, no matter how hard it is to do so. Then the poor last player has to mop up.
Or its off to a player that totally crashes the game and can't get his empire going. Or a player recieves it and goes missing or keeps procrastinating that he'll do it later.

The most important point, a game goes easier at the end so I propose that the first test run be carried out on either Obscene or Suicidal.

But I'm all too anxious to try it out. Great idea, neilo!
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Neilo
DethAdder
Join Date 02/2004
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Reply #163 November 25, 2007 4:24:22 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
One thing you said about the IMs and such. Most if not all GC2 players have SDC and we could just use the IRC chat in there. I don't use any IMs and I'm sure not everyone has the same ones anyways.

You bring up some good points FB, that is why I thought a small controlled group should test the method before trying to expand it too much.

btw: If any of you want to bs once in a while I hang around #galciv on there at times
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Neilo
Neilo
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Reply #164 November 25, 2007 4:29:51 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
Then its off to neilo who builds multiple Military SB arrays and goes ethical alignment to EVIL and builds the famed MCC.


But of course....

Or its off to a player that totally crashes the game and can't get his empire going.


That would of the challenge, trying to save the crippled empire or digging someone out of the hole they got themselves into.
Having the game end early before everyone gets their turn is a real concern though. I am a long game person. It is nothing for me to have a game go 10 years, and i really don't mind that either. Where's others can nail a whole game in a few years.

Another concern would be if it is a MV game obviously the person who starts it will have to submit it. That then means that only one person is getting the benefit of the others skills. Perhaps if we do this we might have to do 4 or 5 games, how ever many are involved so that the scores get spread around.

And if it is a custom race that file will also have to be mailed too, and any ship files. But these are small points to be addressed.

what a concept .
that is another interesting idea!
You know I think this idea is so cool
Great idea, neilo!


Thanks guys...i feel all warm and fuzzy inside ..seriously i didn't think many others would be interested in this, i actually thought of this whilst we were still forming the league!!

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Neilo
Neilo
Join Date 04/2006
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Reply #165 November 25, 2007 4:33:16 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
btw: If any of you want to bs once in a while I hang around #galciv on there at times


Cool, i never..ever!!(wrestling joke) go on the SDC chat. I will have to check it out.
FTR guys, i am on yahoo all the time for those that have it. Neilo_316 go ahead and add me, i always enjoy a chat.
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Neilo
Silverbeacher
Join Date 09/2006
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Reply #166 November 25, 2007 7:29:40 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
interesante, I'm game.
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Neilo
PlayJeff45
Join Date 02/2007
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Reply #167 November 25, 2007 10:12:55 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
I would not know how to Email an entire game, count me out 
As for chat lines, never been on one. I think I may have MSL or something like that, Will check into Yahoo.
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Neilo
dystopic
Join Date 10/2005
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Reply #168 November 25, 2007 10:26:03 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
Dystopic starts and gets a nice colonization phase going


i would be in, but i've got that pesky computer problem

Another concern would be if it is a MV game obviously the person who starts it will have to submit it. That then means that only one person is getting the benefit of the others skills. Perhaps if we do this we might have to do 4 or 5 games, how ever many are involved so that the scores get spread around.


i wouldn't call this a major concern. i'm not using my primary MV character for MVL games, and my sense is very few are.

That would of the challenge, trying to save the crippled empire or digging someone out of the hole they got themselves into.


yeah, exactly. i think if more than 1 group ever tried this competatively, it'd take a lot of discussion before a single turn was ever played (and even on a test run, you'd probably want to spend some time mulling over your and your team mates' various strengths, weaknesses, styles and preferences).

And if it is a custom race that file will also have to be mailed too, and any ship files. But these are small points to be addressed.


might be easiest to back up and delete all the custom files--that way you could back up and zip all the files you need to pass on without fear of losing any or including any you don't need.

Thanks guys...i feel all warm and fuzzy inside ..seriously i didn't think many others would be interested in this, i actually thought of this whilst we were still forming the league!!


don't sell yourself short! i think this idea is really interesting for a number of reasons. we'd previously talked about how making a certain race, or ability scores, etc., part of a round's settings wasn't fun. i think this adds that restriction/feature in a way, but in a fun way. normally when a round's settings are announced, i go right to work to see how i feel about them. with this, it might be good if every player tried a quick game to see how it started, but before anyone tried a real attempt, you'd want to get together and talk about the choices you each want to make.

going back to:
Perhaps if we do this we might have to do 4 or 5 games, how ever many are involved so that the scores get spread around


perhaps everyone should start a game. at the end of game year 1 (2 game years), everyone has to pass their game on to the next person. this would mean no one has to wait around for their turn (at least, not for too long).

damn, i wish i could participate!!!
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Neilo
Neilo
Join Date 04/2006
+128
Reply #169 November 25, 2007 5:35:02 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
perhaps everyone should start a game. at the end of game year 1 (2 game years), everyone has to pass their game on to the next person. this would mean no one has to wait around for their turn (at least, not for too long).


The perfect solution, Each person (Neilo, Da, Dystopic, FB and Silver) starts his own game with whatever race they choose and at their preferred level. Then, as you say we each work out the order of playing the game based on strengths and weaknesses (one would not give me a suicidal game in year 2 perhaps) and we each pass them round. At the very least we would have 5 games worth of mistakes and faults to work out so that way if we do seriously contemplate this idea for the MVL, we have worked out the bugs.

Dystopic, i don't think anyone is in a hurry, we can wait until you are back on board.

Perhaps a dedicated thread for this idea might be best, that way we don't clutter up this one...
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Neilo
dystopic
Join Date 10/2005
+41
Reply #170 December 2, 2007 1:00:08 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
Dystopic, i don't think anyone is in a hurry, we can wait until you are back on board.


i don't believe the wait will be that long. i believe all the parts for my new machine will arrive this week, and i'm hoping to have a great new system up and running by next weekend.

so this idea has been percolating for a while. i have a proposition.

let's start an "MVL Test Lab" thread. we'll use that thread to discuss and manage new and alternative ways we can play GC2 within the MVL framework. the "team games" we've been discussing so far in this thread would be the first test we run in 'the lab.' i don't know about anyone else, but i'd be game for trying other unique setups after this: i mentioned 'relay' games earlier, and i'm sure others have even more interesting ideas. why not create a place to discuss and test them?

i'll also volunteer to be coordinator for the MVL Test Lab. i imagine that neilo, FB and Silver have enough to do as admins for the primary MVL. i'm sure you wouldn't mind having someone else offer to coordinate our experiments with even more innovative ways to enjoy GC2, and i think it could be fun. if that sounds good to everyone, i'll start a new thread and post a re-cap of what we've discussed so far.
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Neilo
Neilo
Join Date 04/2006
+128
Reply #171 December 2, 2007 2:30:11 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
Great idea mate, and by all means...please by our "lab rat"!

I think as you say, there are many different aspects we could play, buy one never really knows how it will all work out till we try. I'm game, let's do it.!!!

I told Silver already but i will be awol for a few days, so don't worry if i don't post straight away. But i will.





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Neilo
dystopic
Join Date 10/2005
+41
Reply #172 December 2, 2007 11:46:17 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
Great idea mate, and by all means...please by our "lab rat"!


alright then! i'll get a new thread started soon.
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