FuzzyMatrix

Join Date 07/2002

A simple tutorial for all player levels

And "editable"/modified by beta players?

The principle is simple: If the tutorial mode is on, you have some interrogation marks ("?") in each place you can click to get information (of course you can make them visible or invisible, at will). These "?" are green, yellow or red.

GREEN: Veeery basic... player playing for the first time.
YELLOW: Middle water.
RED: Strictly for strategic advices as can be found in GalCiv's manual (Brad Wardell goes onto different topics) or in the Orion Sector's "Unofficial Strategy Guide". The only interesting part really

Adds to replayability, adds game depth for most players and to be used all along.

Perhaps it could be toggled off by a checkbox next to any of these information. "Please do not show me yellow/all info again." Of course "Please no tutorial" at the beginning of the game is possible.

Also, if beta testers get the time to test alot, they perhaps would also be able to give some advices to future players. Of course, the two manuals mentioned above may also bring some help.

Comments? Disagreements?

ideas

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I like how in MoO2 you can right click on almost anything and get a description of what it is or does right away. I always found that very handy. Perhaps GC2 could benefit from it as well?

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I like your idea Xyris!!!

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ted techs, buildings, ships, etc.

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ced and strategic" stuff can be of use: I don't want to click on everything to lurn "How to change your sliders"!

Maybe that someone could disable the "green / basic" ones at will and the "red" type stay.

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want such in depth info, adding in a basic "encyclopedia" feature covering that in game would be better then to make it context sensitive. Less resource intensive, easier on Star Dock to maintain and update.

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e, nothing less.

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person who don't even know GalCiv exists while they'd just loooove it!

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t its a different business model. If GC2 sells primarily through Wal-Mart and Best Buy and other retails, then I agree it would be wise for SD to include the advanced topics inside the game, or at a minimum on the CD.

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For whatever it's worth, I plan on buying GalCiv 2 at a local store - I like having the game on CD, even if it does eventually get patched. It's easier for me to keep track of in my library of games.

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Zoomba

Join Date 11/2002

+114

re crippled at all.

Just a thought

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ff like that in GalCiv2. It's just for skinning the UI. Currently, it's only using scripting information for resizing the windows.

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Fuzzy... do you know what infitesimal proportion of gamers that actually look at the medium or advanced level topics that are included inside SMAC and Civ3?

Do you realize that GC2's primary distribution manner will be online? If you sell a game primarily online, it wouldn't be unusual to think players will go to your web site to look for more information... if that is where most went to order the game in the first place. I wouldn't suggest that Civ4 leave out the moderate and advanced info, because that game will sell large number of units (250K? 500K?), and most of those customers will buy that game from a retail outlet (even if 30% pre-order it online from a retailer). But its a different business model. If GC2 sells primarily through Wal-Mart and Best Buy and other retails, then I agree it would be wise for SD to include the advanced topics inside the game, or at a minimum on the CD.

erm... yep

Well first of all so called "advanced" information of Civ3 or SMAC are crap for doing anything "advanced". They form a very normal tutorial, as all others with the basic stuff. Not the strategy. And NOT, absolutely NOT, the kind of info my teacher gave me to "teach me how to use Windows to get to the statistic course's program to work". DAMNIT! I can figure this out by myself if I played a bunch of games in the past.

Second: Is GC sold mostly online?!! I heard otherwise... Most of the money comes from online sales though, as it pays the developers alot more. And even if it would sell mostly online, I disagree with you when you say that it means those people actually take the time to scan the web for strategy. We don't have 10 000 forum subscribers I guess. Even if it would be the case, it is still not as efficient as info found where you want it, when you want it.

Third: The cost of doing such a "strategy tool", should there be a demand, may not be very high given that some players are doing it. Even if I'd be surprised if even 10% of GalCivers knew the Orion Sector guide. If it's 1%, it may be surprising. Such info, as tutorials, must be at the right place, at the right moment: that is, very accessible on demand.

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FuzzyMatrix... SMAC's advanced material includes the formula that the game uses to generate its numbers! You know, growth, corruption, etc etc etc. You cannot get more "advanced" then that. But the number of players that actually investigated that info, out of the the hundreds of thousands of units of SMAC sold was extremely low. It was nice for the hardest of hardest of hardest hard core grognards to have. They got the numbers, and translated that for the rest of the gaming community. Note that. Not even the majority of hardcore players could map out the metrics correctly. Anyone that wanted to know, they got online or looked through many a strategy guide to interpret that info into something they could understand. And even then, most people interested went crawling through the net to make sure they understood it correctly, even if they had to travel 70 miles to some library to use their free access!

If you are talking a product like a Prima Strategy Guide explaining how to maximize your explotiation of the AI, maximize your growth curve, and win easily every time regardless of what settings you use, then Stardock should definately NOT include that info in the game. Period. Full stop! If the game has a large enough market for such, then Stardock should sell that, or farm out selling such a strategy guide (and get a good piece of that action).

Information is power. StarDock should not include a "how to beat Maso every game, every time" in the game. It shouldn't even include a "how to win on cakewalk, everytime" with the game. Basic instructions, definately. But past that, they really shouldn't do more then SMAC or Civ3. The actual maximizing of your growth slopes, they shouldn't bother wasting their time on that. There will be hundreds of players putting out "how tos...", and quickly. And it means they don't waste time having to figure out what the new optimal strategy is, and update your docs, every time they change something in the game.

I know a lot of GC players cruised through the GC forums, when they wanted tips on playing better. Why should StarDock waste one cent of their time on capturing that info, when others will do it for them, for free? Why should they waste their resources on putting out cheater or how to win guides with their product, when, if it is really in demand, they can make $$$ off a Strategy Guide? Make it a PDF, and let TotalGaming subscribers pull it down for free... but make us straight product buyers have to buy it if we want it.

The answer is simple... players would post all the tips and tricks and "How to always win max maso games in 555 keypresses" on the forums. And dozens, if not hundreds, of their customers will copy off the better guides and host them on their sites, and burn them to CD for their buds or their own offline browsing.

GC is and was sold mostly online. Last we heard from Brad.

(If he has ever said different, I missed it.) A lot of retail buyers certainly get online and pull down the patches. The figure was mentioned at ~70% to 80% of retail buyers. If that is true, that means a huge majority of their customers can and do get online whenever they have need of it. Might be a hassle for a minority (what portion? 15%? 30%? I have no clue), but they can and do so. So...

The cost of doing such a tool stacks up quickly. It's not a one off thing. Stardock would need to assign someone to do it. And then, they got to keep it up for every change that SD makes to the official game. Think about it... every time Brad adjusts the AI, that could mean that the optimal path moves. Then the guide has to be updated to take that into account. Then consider... are you playing for fastest win, or highest score in the metaverse? They are not necessarily the same thing. So what should be the official "Best Play" way? Or should Stardock be putting out guides on Fastest Conquest (per size/rarity), Fastest Research Win, etc etc etc?

I believe it is better for Star Dock to let the community post, refine, and host such things. Star Dock needs to provide the basics for new players. Anything past that, and it won't be long before their own customers can find more up to date info in the GC community. Or before some of those community members know more about the balance of power in Star Dock. Indeed, that's one of the things Star Docks mines the community for... the best strategy paths to win. That's so that they can update the AI to take advantage of such things.

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Update: In Brad's latest interview on GC2 beta, given to CG Online. He stated that they sold 120K units retail. But he also states that GC1 is earning 6 digits of money annually purely from online sales. That sounds like online has more units sold then retail to me, but that's just a wild guess on my part.

He also mentions that GC2 will be easier to find on retail shelves when it goes production, versus GC1.

I still think they should let the "how to win in 555 keypresses" be a seperate guide. But now I wonder how complex the basic info should be and should include, if the primary method of distribution is going to be retail CD/DVD for the first year.

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