Evil Stormbringer

Join Date 08/2006

FreeRAMXP

Has anyone else tried it?

Okay, so I never claimed to be great with a PC but since my CTD issues have been pretty steady with regards to any gigantic, huge, or even large galaxies I decided to try a medium sized map and see what happens. I still had a CTD with the infamous header of 'memory write error', which is always the case so I decided to get the most out of my vid card and hook up an old monitor so that I could monitor a few things while playing.
I started a new game, medium galaxy w/all abundant and had FreeRAMXP and nvidia's control panel running to monitor my temperature levels, not that temp was ever a thought, but just in case.
Just loading the game takes my system from around 810 RAM to roughly 300 or so (my numbers given at this time are roughly estimated since I am at work, but they are pretty close to original). So I set FreeRAM up to do it's thing when RAM drops below 500, with a wait time of 30 seconds before freeing RAM again. It has at times freed RAM up to four times just upon loading a saved game (my setting is to free an optimal amount of RAM, nothing number specific). While actually playing the game I am at roughly 530 free RAM or so. Sometimes it will drop below 500 prompting FreeRAM to do it's thing, other times it drops to maybe 515 or so.
Everything seems to hold steady as long as the magic RAM number of roughly 500 free RAM is available (like I said, I haven't had a CTD since trying this with FreeRAM running but it doesn't mean that it may not happen). The strange part is that if FreeRAM does free some RAM during actual game play, over time the amount of RAM will actually rise to around 640 or so.
Oh, and just to mention, temperature could never have been an issue as on start up it runs around 45 C, during the heaviest playing session it never went over 51 C.
FreeRAM also monitors the CPU load and usage which I must say, get pretty taxed by DA from what I saw. I have an AMD +3800 2.4 and CPU load was at 62% at it's max with CPU usage constantly topping out at 100% and usually hovering between 70% to 90% each turn.
My bottom line, and again I AM NOT SAYING I KNOW ABOUT THESE THINGS, is that there seems to be a memory issue here and maybe not just with my PC but the game itself. I am not sure how the RAM actually rises over time while playing, but it does. I also remember some people in here mentioning something about a memory leak issue with this game but I am not sure what it is exactly so no comment there, just a thought.
So if any of you devs, or anyone who has used this program, stumble across this I would like to know your thoughts.

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Hi!
Reading your post it come to my mind your comp could have defective RAM. At work we're using a free program to test this issue: memtest86 (www.memtest86.com). I suggest you making a full check. On your comp it would probably take about 30 minutes to finish.

BR, Iztok

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Reading your post it come to my mind your comp could have defective RAM. At work we're using a free program to test this issue: memtest86 (www.memtest86.com).

Yeah, Kryo mentioned it last week and I've already done that. Everything checks fine so I feel pretty confident (also ran two other program tests, the names escape me at the moment) that my hardware is up to snuff although I am DEFINITELY upgrading from 1GB to 3GB just because. I also know that the devs have said that this game really pushes the hell out of your systems RAM so I figured that was what I was seeing. It would help if someone who POSITIVELY knows that their RAM is good could run FreeRAM while playing with the same settings that I was using preferably and see what they come up with.
I haven't tried this with any other games... obviously because I can't put DA down!

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kryo

Join Date 05/2003

+458

The game uses a lot of memory, especially on big maps. There's not really any way around that short of the devs working to improve the game's memory management, which they have done and continue to do.

FYI, utilities made to free up memory are almost always a bad thing, especially when playing a game such as GC2. The game will try to use all the system memory it needs, since that is MUCH faster than using the swapfile, but a utility like that will force it to use the swap file much earlier and much more (that's what it does to free memory--force it off into the swap file).

RAM's purpose is to be used--if it isn't, it's going to waste.

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FYI, utilities made to free up memory are almost always a bad thing, especially when playing a game such as GC2.

Maybe so Kryo but at the moment it's all I can do to actually get a game in, and that's only using a medium map. Hopefully adding more RAM will fix my problems and allow me to go back to gigantic galaxies. If it is more to do with the game however I do hope that the devs are working to fix the issues.

It doesn't seem like FreeRAM is causing any issues within the game itself so until I free up the 170.00 on my card... can't wait to Newegg!!!!

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RAM's purpose is to be used--if it isn't, it's going to waste.

Just had to ask... since it seems like the CTD comes on at anything less than 500 mb RAM... is this possible? Not worded right, but I am sure you know what I am asking you Kryo. Thanks again.

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kryo

Join Date 05/2003

+458

The game *should* be able to suck up every last bit of your RAM should it need to. If there's no hardware issue, I'm not sure why it would be crashing at a particular amount of memory usage.

Yeah, Kryo mentioned it last week and I've already done that. Everything checks fine

I'm curious, how long did you run the test for? Some issues may not manifest if you only give it one pass--to get a thorough and accurate result under heavy usage, it's best to run it at least a few hours. Generally when building a new machine and testing it the first time, people will even run it for an entire day. Another test to try would be Prime95 in Blend mode, ran for at least a few hours (overnight works).

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That's interesting Evil - I've noticed RAM usage go up to 1.5Gb on my system (seems to be linked to the number of invasions I'm doing as it only ever goes up in times of mass genocide).

Whilst I don't get any CTDs, I do get problems with it failing to save properly when RAM usage gets that high - with an "out of memory" error. Others over at the Core have experienced this also. I don't suppose you have auto-save enabled, are running in full screen and can tie the CTDs into the same turns as the auto-save?

The interesting part is that 1.5Gb is 500Mb under my total physical ram of 2Gb - there is still 4Gb of page file available when this "out of memory" error occurs.

So, for Kryo, the questions to ask are:

1. What, in the invasion process (I'm assuming this is the reason as it is the only time I see the problem), is causing RAM usage to be increased, and more importantly not released afterwards (garbage collection failing maybe)?

2. Why the "out of memory" error when the system clearly isn't, either physical or virtual.

This isn't causing me any real issues (unlike Evil) as one save / reload every 3-4 hours of play sets the RAM usage back to normal - but it is looking like there could be some problems with memory management.

@Evil - I suggested in a previous thread about this that it was just your system causing the problem. Apologies for that, as it looks like you may have hit on something more fundamental.

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I'm curious, how long did you run the test for?

No where near as long as you are suggesting, but a couple of hours IIRC (I usually have a lot of things going on when I am doing things with the PC such as system tests/scans). I'll definitely give it another go, again, just to be sure.

I don't suppose you have auto-save enabled, are running in full screen and can tie the CTDs into the same turns as the auto-save?

No. I've turned auto save off (always thought that was 'one' of my issues, whether it was or not I haven't got a clue). Yes, I run in full screen mode (haven't tried windowed but I plan on trying it). So obviously, no to the auto save ? since I have it disabled.
I'm just trying everything I can think of instead of being counter-productive like I was with all of my ranting across threads. I get frustrated with things that I cannot fix myself if it is possible to do so. I believe I've exhausted all of my options with regards to my own hardware but I won't rule it out as I am not a qualified tech. All of the input is greatly appreciated.

edit: Just to add, while running FreeRAM it seems that the virtual memory stays pretty much untouched, or so it seems. Maybe the numbers fluctuate at a minimal amount or something like that. Wanted to throw this one in here. Never seem to have an issue with the virtual memory.

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RAM's purpose is to be used--if it isn't, it's going to waste.

Personally I've never been happy to use memory freeing utilities, It has always struck me as a bit of a botch fix. IMO, some third party app interfering with the system memory can do nothing but cause problems, If I start to run out of RAM, I simply buy more.

I just hope this fixes your issues. When you get your new 2Gb I suggest you remove the original 1Gb and see if the problem persists.

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