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Richrf
Richrf
Join Date 04/2006
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Improving tech trading by restriction

May 25, 2006 1:25:51 AM from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
One of the most cheesy ways to exploit tech trading is as follows..

Totally ignore weapon/defense tech (just stop at space militarization which provides +10 military bonus), while working on peaceful techs.

When the Ai starts getting itchy, you start preparing a military for defense. Find some Ai opponent (minor races is fine) and trade for their top or second top weapon tech, thereby saving on all the research in between. You can leap frog from nothing to Harpoons III or better depending on the AI difficulty.

This loophole benefits the humans a lot more than the AI because typically, the AI has very balanced research priorities.

Also this tech leap frogging effect is strongest for the weapon/defense lines (which the computer pritorizes and is often ahead) because in 99% of the cases, there is no need to acquire lower techs items, unlike say in other tech lines where techs give bonuses. Heck in some cases, acquring a top line plantery improvement without acquring those in between can even hurt.....

Granted the AI could be tweaked to consider not only the RP cost of the tech, but also the RP tech in between saved, but that's not easy. I think it's easier to simply restrict tech trading so if you trade for a highly advanced tech that you don't have the last N (say 3) prequisite for it, it is simply too advanced and you can't understand it.

Say N=3
So you can't trade for laser IV unless you have at least laser I .

Maybe the AI can jeer at you when you ask for it, by saying "This tech is too advanced for your primative culture" or something.

Similarly tech stealing via spying or conquering planets would be restricted in the same way.

If you want to get fancy, you can allow such advanced techs to be bought/stolen but they don't kick in until you research the prequisite techs, and these prequisite techs get a research bonus...

Altough, the AI will never ever be smart about tech trading as humans, I think this is a fairly simple improvement that can be added in which will close off one of the ways humans exploit tech trading.

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Richrf
Richrf
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Reply #1 May 25, 2006 10:47:17 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
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Richrf
No118
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Reply #2 May 25, 2006 11:01:07 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
I would prefer the AI to consider the cost of all the techs in between. They already spot when you try to trade them Laser I and Laser II together so it can't be that hard.
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Richrf
The Limey
Join Date 05/2006
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Reply #3 May 25, 2006 11:13:47 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
That sounds like a really good idea.
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Richrf
MaverickMW
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Reply #4 May 25, 2006 12:18:55 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
Either that of forbid trading of a tech unless the previous tech is known. So race A can't give race B LaserII if Race A doesn't have LaserI already. Of course, Race B could give both though.
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Richrf
Feud
Join Date 02/2006
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Reply #5 May 25, 2006 12:44:02 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
Either that of forbid trading of a tech unless the previous tech is known. So race A can't give race B LaserII if Race A doesn't have LaserI already. Of course, Race B could give both though.


The problem I have with that is, if I want to aid a race int hier war with someone, I dont want to have to go through the entire tech tree just to give them the tech I want. Further, since the AI has been tweaked so that you cannot give multiple gifts to increase relations (cheesing your way out of war), I want my gifts to be really good when I give them. I say stick witht he status quo.
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Richrf
Big Jim Slade
Join Date 05/2006
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Reply #6 May 25, 2006 1:53:20 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
It would make sense to me if you could only trade military techs with allies.
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Richrf
Richrf
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Reply #7 May 25, 2006 3:19:59 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
I would prefer the AI to consider the cost of all the techs in between. They already spot when you try to trade them Laser I and Laser II together so it can't be that hard.


Spotting if A is a prequisite of B is much easier i think then trying to value the sum of all the prequisite techs.

Anyway I think you are in effect asking the AI to value the tech in terms of how useful laser IV is to the human player, which i believe the AI doesn't do because it can get very complicated.

My proposal has another advantage in that it discourages cheesy traps, where you give away a colony to a tech superior race then conquer it in hope of getting a super high end tech.

You could still get a lower tech of course....

Either that of forbid trading of a tech unless the previous tech is known. So race A can't give race B LaserII if Race A doesn't have LaserI already. Of course, Race B could give both though.


Yes, but i prefer to give some flexibility so you can leap frog maybe 2-3 techs ahead. This allows greater trading opportunties....

The problem I have with that is, if I want to aid a race int hier war with someone, I dont want to have to go through the entire tech tree just to give them the tech I want.


This seems to be more an interface problem. I used to find tech trading difficult because it was hard to find the correct tech or I would be wondering if "photon torpedos" was better than "Photonic torpedos".


Further, since the AI has been tweaked so that you cannot give multiple gifts to increase relations (cheesing your way out of war), I want my gifts to be really good when I give them. I say stick witht he status quo.



Not sure what you mean, my understanding is that giving gifts too many times in sucessive multiple turns will have no effect.

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