Yuhjn1972

Join Date 07/2009

Military Starbase tricks and tips

I've seen a lot of people poo-poo the military starbase. I'm still pretty new to the game, but I've had great success with them on the top difficulty levels.

Here are some tricks I found:

Assist based modules, the ones that add to the attack of your ships, stack. In other words if you have TWO military starbases that have overlapping areas of effect, and both have the SAME assist modules, your fighters in that overlap area are affected by the assist of both starbases.
Enemy AI sets the value of your starbases very high. Often if you position them well you can get an opponent to throw all their ships at one. As long as you have enough constructors nearby to repair it back up (using the repair module) you can withstand massive fleet attacks. When built up enough I commonly use one or two constructors to take out a dozen enemy ships)
Remember that the assist bonuses are PER SHIP. So if you are going to use assist bases, dont even both with bigger hull ships. Instead create the small hull fighters and crank your logistics. The assist bonus from your star-bases affects each ship in your fleet and your overall fleet strength will go through the roof, the bigger it is.
The tech cost of getting into the 3rd tier of starbase fortification is very well worth it. If you compare it to the cost of logistics, weapons, defense, miniturization, and so on that it requires to get your fleets up to that same level of power, it costs several times more research.

Incidently as I was learning the game I found the power of starbases while doing the campaigns. Those dreadlords are so powerful and they just kept mopping the floor with me. I tried a half-dozen different approaches and they just completely destroyed me. Until I build a starbase.

I rushed the tech-tree into starbase fort III (didnt even research anti-grav) and built one within 5 moves (the speed of the default constructor) of my forward-most planet. I poured all my military spending into constructors and upgraded it using as few as 5 constructors to have like 40,40,40 attack. The dread lords showed up right on schedule, confident that they were going to go through me like poop through a goose. The flew that frigit right into my 40,40,40 starbase and I actually shrieked when the friget exploded and my starbase was still there.

I still didnt win that game, because while all the dreadlords attack vessles were going after my single massively upgraded starbase, all my planets were just pumping out constructors to keep it up. Everything was great until the dreadlords showed up with the transports. Those guys just flew right by my starbase and took over several planets before i could build up.

From there I just kept a small minimally equipped fleet back that would clean up transports while the dreadlords just wrecked all their ships on my starbase.

From there the path to victory was pretty easy.

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Hi!

I've seen a lot of people poo-poo the military starbase. I'm still pretty new to the game

When you'll bave under your belt more sandbox games, you too will pop-poo on the mil SB most of the time, because of 3 reasons:

1) they are static.

2) price/performace ratio for DA and TA is bad, and just average for DL.

3) In DA and TA they can't survive fleet attack.

BR, Iztok

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I just don't see a point for Mil SBs in TA. Sure the bonus's can add up to a crapload but after that sector has become a safezone and the enemy is tossed out least for me they tend to leave it alone. And since those big bonus's are gone soon as the ships leave the area no point. Useful for just draining some enemy ships but easier imo to do that with a ship build thats built with their weapons/def in mind.

One game I built 5 ringing my perimeter thinking could soak up enemy ships.... all were pretty much maxed out and 2 were destroyed by not so powerful but large fleets. Others were ignored since I was also troop transport rushing and expanded my area well past the mil SBs in about 10 turns worth of them finishing.

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I think the Mil SBs can be useful not as a defensive aid but as an OFFENSIVE one.

That is, one can take along a fleet of constructors when pushing deep into enemy space. Then, build the base where major fleet battles are expected. In DA, make sure it extends onto planets with the fleet defense structure and a lot of ships. In TA, this might be any planets where the enemy has lots of ships (in TA, they will have built the empire-wide defense improvement).

The same turn (or the one after, I forget) the base is built and upgraded, one can attack with all the Mil base bonuses.

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I've found them pretty useful in a support role, but feel that they should be more gradated - you should be able to make very powerful, but expensive to support starbases, or cheaper 'lowlevel' starbases.

As it is I think they are more powerful than they should be for the relatively inexpensive upkeep, and not as powerful as they should be for what they cost in time and opportunity cost to build.

I'd also dearly like to be able to build planetary and/or orbital starbases - there's really no good reason why anything you can build on a starbase you can't put in orbit or on a planet.

Jonnan

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I find them more useful on smaller maps. if you research starbase fortification quickly and build some constructors you can have a starbase which is much more powerful than any ships you or the enemy can build at that time.

Playing as the Arceans earlier I had a military starbase fully upgraded at the first level (8 in each weapon and defense category) the most powerful race attacked me and this starbase must of destroyed literally hundreds of ships! it got to level 15 and had over 150 HP, I thought it might give me enough time to build up a force as every ship the enemy had was attacking it, but then another much more advanced race attacked me and it was destroyed (couldnt get constructors to it to repair it).

in the early game this starbase made my small weak empire very powerful, if i'd been able to get constructors to it i reckon it could of lasted indefinately.. getting more powerful with time.

on larger maps or later in the game I usually only use them for the speed increase/decrease modules

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The "enemy ship speed -2" upgrade is available from the beginning, costs no credits, and helps you catch those weakened enemy ships which are trying to retreat. More chance to spot imcoming enemy ships and transports before they attack. The Dreadlord transports spring to mind.

The "assist" modules really are assist - they do not help defences of ships which have no defences. I usually have a small armour tech research early on. Even my space miners (cargo hulls with 1 attack and 1 defence and speed) become formidable idlers.

Remember that the assist bonuses are PER SHIP. So if you are going to use assist bases, dont even both with bigger hull ships. Instead create the small hull fighters and crank your logistics

They are cheap and quick to replace ("tiny" hulls).

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Military SB's rock, but I do have to admit I almost never play anything but on abundant/abundant. OTOH, economy SB's aren't so great on sparse galaxies, either. I've been playing on Obscene (mostly), some Suicidal, and everyone else gets so far ahead of me in tech it's not even funny. These military SB babies even out the game. What's nice is that the AI doesn't consider your 8 constructors in his territory a threat. So you send in your puny armada (no transports) for a surprise attack and pick off all his defenders. So what if your military SB is static--the idiot AI keeps rebuilding his defenders, which you keep picking off until your transports find their new homes and you steal his tech. And now, guess what: your military SB is exactly where it needs to be: defending your new-found planets just building up, soaking the other guy's counterattack.

I can't tell you how many times this proved to be the turning point in the game for me. Mostly because I haven't played ToA in so long. It's evil, it's backstabbing, it's cheap, it's exploitative, it's perfect.

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Maiden666

Join Date 12/2008

+62

Quoting tetleytea,

reply 7

I only can second that, Tetley. In fact, this is one of the very few advantages a player has left to win a suicidal warfighting. With his 100% econ bonus you´ll never match his research in weapon-tech or producing/funding capital warships either. Plus he´s not going to trade weapon-tech in ToA.

Besides, tiny constructors are damn cheap to produce, as well as tiny 1/1 ships for the MSB swarm. If you invade a system of a superior enemy with 100 constructors, 25 1/1, transports and a few un-armed fast sensor-ships (that might lure enemy forces away...) then this system is yours - and stays yours. The support of 4 MSB will far-outmatch the force of even Dreadnoughts w Nighmare Torpedo, and no problem if some of your tiny´s are lost during an attack - in one turn they can be reproduced for virtually no bc.

Besides, an early MSB might boost-up your military rating so far that the AI will refrain from declaring war on you - and it´s an cheap solution to say, races that lack the SCC.... and with the saved force on weapon tech and ship maint one might easily focus on other ways to win...

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Military starbases can slow down incoming enemy fleets quite a bit, so long as their areas of effect overlap. This basically gives you extra time to get your ships to where they're needed.

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I like to build a nexus at a 4-quadrant corner for a fleet rendezvous, then put 16 SBs so that the +2 speed boosts add 32 movement factors to the fleet. This allows easy intercepts, a strong invasion thrust that can pick off a lot of planets on that first invasion turn, and can also allow non-engine ships and constructors to be used in that first turn.

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I've never particularly been a fan of overlapping Military SB's too much. Maybe on sparser galaxies, where you know exactly the direction the AI is beelining from...the AI doesn't exactly take evasive maneuvers. Then maybe you could stack. But on abundant, what I really need is coverage more than anything. Plus when I use military SB's, I tend to be losing. When you're winning and you can build all the pretty starbase grids, you don't really need a starbase. I'll just add those +1 speed modules where convenient, after the fact. They do help--like when your empire has expanded, your military SB's are now irrelevant, you're paying maintenance on them. A little +1 speed bump in the middle of your empire helps. You're shuttling transports from your rear of your empire to the front lines the whole game. I've looked into those slingshot grids (that's what I nickname them), but with all the investment, I'd really rather invest the credits toward researching Hyperwarp instead.

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WIllythemailboy

Join Date 03/2006

+70

On immense maps, an array is a godsend. Being able to slingshot no-engine constructors, transports, or warshps 70 or more spaces at once is a fast way to react to a sudden opportunity.

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Exactly!

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I usually wind up with "trade routes" of military SB's instead of slingshots. i.e. a couple of SB's here, with some speed on them...which leads to SB's there, with some more speed, which leads to.... This is on abundant, of course. They're a byproduct of past battles. They're just sitting there, so might as well just throw on some speed modules (and -1 speed modules) for cheap. It's not as ideal as a slingshot grid, but I'm not investing 100+ constructors, either. I've got econ starbases to attend to. Which let you produce more constructors...which by that time the game's won, anyway.

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I love starbases so much, thanks for the tips, after reading all the comments I am getting ideas how to beat those dang yor in my snadbox game and rack up some points on the metaverse : >

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Extant Faora

Join Date 08/2008

Question involving Starbase Conquest Strategy.

Can you use them as a Planetary Assault tactic if built close to enemy planets?

(PS-I love slingshot grids.)

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Maiden666

Join Date 12/2008

+62

No, you can't. But that's a nice idea actually, and yes, some of the names of the Military Starbases Techs are quite deceiving.

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I have been playing for several years and never considered military SBs. I usually avoid direct combat. My current game I have yet to be at war. I am top dog by far and have been paying others to go to war against the number two. I build a lot of economic SBs. I used to use influence ones which I quit using about the time I turned that victory off. I usually concor plannets with influence w/o the need for the bases. After the comments here, I am considering a military game next so that I can see how they work.

I find the large variety of items in the game keep it from ever getting dull. I am on my way to my first assension win. I just need to keep the rest of the universe from giving up to me for about 220 turns as they have just started doing.

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I trade or purchase the scout ships of other races in exchange of bc's and/or tech. Then when I have 1 or 2 levels of miniaturization researched, I can design a tiny hull with a constructor module (but with no engine).

I put the scout in position where I want to build the starbase, upgrade the scout to a constructor with no engine and use it to build or upgrade my starbases.

I've only used military starbases as a support module for an invasion when a race declares a war on me. It is usefull if I don't yet have the Xalanx / Zalon / Tulon defensive and Weapon amp bonus.

I find though that having 1 Weapon amp in a fleet and one Xalanx bonus is a gre at way to beef up a fleet. A fleet with those bonuses will take out a fleet of ships that have more advanced technology.

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If you've researched far along the propulsion tech tree, you'll find several modules which slow down enemy ships. You can use these on military starbases to build an interdiction zone. Your enemy with his fancy warp engines comes zooming in and then has to crawl towards your space as slow as 1pc/week.

This means that if you really need to mobilise a defence fleet to stop those incoming ships, they'll have more time to get there.

Downside is, if the fleet is powerful enough to warrant interception, it's probably powerful enough to wipe the floor with a starbase.

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In my most recent game of Twilight of Arnor, I was playing as Altarian and was planning to attack the Korath. They saw the troop buildup and declared war on me first. (Other races declared war on the Korath).

The Korath ships were more powerful than mine and I couldn't make a dent in their defence. (I had saved my game prior to attempting the invasion).

I retreated back towards my space and I upgraded the 4/5 scouts I had to constructors without any engines and I built a military starbase. I got the module that increases the laser damage, the one that slows down enemy ships and the one that increases the shielding.

This made a huge difference. It allowed my fleet to destroy the pursuing fleet and then go back and invade the planet as my military starbase covered the Korath home world.

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