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Stormkeep
Join Date 10/2004
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AI Colonization Stupidity

AI Tweak needed

March 19, 2008 2:33:57 AM from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums

The AI seems to be pretty dense when it comes to creating colonies.   Even on very high intelligence levels, it doesn't seem like it is smart enough to consider the impact of Opponent's Influence on a new colony.   Just some examples from recent games:

In my current game, my Influence is the second highest (2nd only to the Thallan), and it's good enough to push against them to keep their border from enroaching on my claimed worlds.    The silly bugs recently sent a colony ship all the way to the heart of my empire to colonize Mars....    Obviously, they had no chance of holding it, it flipped to me before they got the 2nd embassy up and running on it.

In my last game, by the latter part of Mid-Game I had a sprawling Empire that crossed the map at a diagnal.  My sphere of influence at the ends was large, but in the middle, not so much (Sorta shaped like a diagnal hourglass), because the Krynn and Thallan were on each side of me in the middle pushing back relatively hard.    The Drengin, crazy little guys that they are, kept colonizing world after world down in my southern end.   Some of these flipped to me so fast I hadn't even noticed they were settled when I was getting the message that the planet chose to join me.   AT one point when this happened, I was actually at war with the Drengin, so it HAD to flip fast for me to not have noticed a planet with their flag show up in space I "owned".  I got about 7 or 8 colonies this way in relatively short order (after which there were no more non-settled planets in my territory).

Considering the investment of both construction time AND population that Colony Ships require, it seems a bit crazy for the AI to basically just give the player free colonies.      It shouldn't be too hard for the AI to do an Influence check on the environs of an uninhabited world and decide "not gonna work". 

This has always seemed a problem to me, but I'm only saying something now because it's only recently I've played with difficulty levels where I didn't just assume it was the AI intentially being stupid.  Set above average, the AI should NEVER do this, imho.  And it does it, pretty much always.    I could intentionally hamper nearby opponent economies just by leaving many low class worlds unsettled in the heart of my empire.

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Notger
Join Date 04/2006
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Reply #1 March 19, 2008 4:46:08 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
That is an exploit I also witnessed very often.
Maybe the AI gambles in a way that flipping still would not be certain and a colony ship is quite cheap, after all. Maybe there is a certain chance that the colony becomes strong and can survive in your sphere of influence. I do not know.
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mrakomo
Join Date 07/2007
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Reply #2 March 19, 2008 6:22:05 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
Yes it is so. I did not colonized Mars once, because I planned to flip it. The result was my territory has been compromised, but I was unable to flip the planet and I was too weak to declare war.
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Stormkeep
Join Date 10/2004
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Reply #3 March 20, 2008 1:37:11 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
Ouch, Mrakomo...that would bug the heck out of me. So maybe I've just been very lucky in that I manage to flip these quickly; I'm not sure what the formulaes are for calculating this sort of thing. Seeing it always happen had me assume the AI was being pretty dumb, but based on your experience, maybe not so much.

Thank you for the replies.
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Starchaser12
Join Date 08/2007
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Reply #4 March 20, 2008 11:26:02 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
It's not so dumb to COLONIZE said world. What's dumb is not following it up.

I have mentioned before that my favorite mode of victory is to turn off influence victory and win a conquest victory via influence flipping.

There are two ways to attack an enemy this way. (well, there are more than two, but for simplicity's sake I'm just going to address 1) The first is the standard 'influence starbase by the border'.

The second means involves a) getting all the colonization techs as early as possible, and colony-rushing every low grade world in the opponents area, and then build influence improvements. (you have to buy the first dozen or so, until you have enough of a background influence web that new colonies won't be above the 4.0 influence value) I actually got the idea from watching the AI trying to flood my area with low grade colonies while I was trying to race to grab high class colonies on the other side of his area. (and yes, there is more to the strategy than this. I'm just pointing out what could be done though)
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Lloyd007
Join Date 03/2003
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Reply #5 March 20, 2008 12:02:27 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
The big thing is the followup. In one of my current games I left a lot of low PQ planets uncolonized simply because I was going for juicier targets. The Terrans colonized piecemeal and I got three colonies from them quickly. The Drath spammed colony ships and got 4 colonies up in short order which was enough to keep them safe (until I invaded, that is, then I got a boatload of free techs...)
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Scintor
Join Date 05/2006
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Reply #6 March 20, 2008 4:11:21 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
I use this to my advantage all of the time. I always colonise all of the best planets in order of their usefullness. I have no problem letting a the odd forgien colony in my area, because it usually comes to my side in time.

This is especially usefull in a passive aggressive influence campaign. I have been using this for a while and have recently added buying strategic planets from other civs just after they have been colonized. The result is that I get all the best planets and most flip to me in an easy victory. It is so easy that I often turn off the influence victory condition to make the game last longer.

Ouch, Mrakomo...that would bug the heck out of me. So maybe I've just been very lucky in that I manage to flip these quickly; I'm not sure what the formulaes are for calculating this sort of thing. Seeing it always happen had me assume the AI was being pretty dumb, but based on your experience, maybe not so much.


As for the formulaes, I don't know what the exact formulas are, but from experience, each planet with the skull and crossbones has about 5% chance of flipping in any given turn (1 in 20.) The exception to this is when a given empire drops to three planets or less. Then it drops to about 1% (you also cannot buy planets from an empire that has three or less.)

Scincerely,

Scintor@aol.com
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DarkMadMax
Join Date 03/2006
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Reply #7 March 20, 2008 9:19:59 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
It is wierd but I never experienced colonies flipping . - I Think they have to be discontent in order to do that.
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Temierus
Join Date 09/2006
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Reply #8 March 20, 2008 9:49:50 PM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
I've noticed this too, and it almost seems like the AI just loves to have everything colonized, especially when it's an empire that seems to want to control through influence. I kind of find it annoying, I mean I get colonizing but there is eventually a point where it's really not worth it in the long run and the AI dosen't seem to acknowledge that when they should.
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scott mazanek
Join Date 02/2007
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Reply #9 March 23, 2008 3:53:20 AM
from GalCiv II ForumsGalCiv II Forums
I don't know if this is the exact same thing but some times my opponent doesn't have the money to maintain the new colonies that it sets up in my space. After they flip I suddenly have a bunch of colonies that are next to worthless and really unhappy and it lowers my empires overall moral. All this on top of having to spend money to do something with them.
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