jmatt

Join Date 11/2006

Military production bonus

Sweeet!

I recently experimented with the military production bonus while starting a new game and I have to say, I rather like it. For 4 ability points, you get a 50% productivity increase. When combined with other bonus buffs, it's now at 80%.

To me, it's starting to seem like a no brainer. I mean, think about it: the game is about cranking out ships and sending them out to build starbases or destroy other ships. Almost all other considerations (economy, diplomacy, morale, research, planet quality, etc) are merely factors toward achieving that goal.

Why tinker with the production factors when you can cut straight to the chase and boost output directly? It seems to me that a 50% military production bonus could be worth more than 4 other bonuses combined.

Plus it's allowing me to more quickly build a respectable military and keep the AI off my back. I'm not saying the other factors aren't important, I'm just saying that I think the military production bonus provides the most bang for the buck when starting a game. Try it.

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In GC2:DL I felt the same way, but for different reasons. It helps with the colony rush. Purchasing colony ships outright is just too expensive--need to purchase factories and build colony ships the old fashioned way. +50% military means you crank them out every other turn, and purchase less factories.

Through different patches of Dread Lords, they juggled around the racial abilities/costs a bit. I think in 1.4 you can also get away with choosing Industrialist and putting your points into Economy instead. I disagree with you philosophically to a small extent, in the sense that I think the game is really all about taking 1 bc of industrial capacity and matching it up with 1 bc of money. All the +50% military bonus does is give you more capacity.

In the Dark Avatar beta, I started out with the +50% military setting, but I've played around with other settings and it can work without it. They nerfed the colony rush some, and as you get later into the game you don't need the +50 military as bad--especially compared to needing money. Super Hive doesn't need +50 military at all--they need money, period. Other races (e.g. Super Dominator, Super Annihilator) can get away with an early planetary invasion rush instead of a colony rush, so I would argue pop growth is a nicer choice for them (Super Breeder can invasion rush, too, but they can use the military bonus).

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DivineWrath

Join Date 05/2006

+135

I agree that many different abilities are quite powerful if used correctly. The +50% military bonus would work well with the colony rush if combined with something like the PQ improving ability. That combination would not only get you more planets quicker, but also make those you do get even better.

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Philocthetes

Join Date 10/2003

+153

I disagree with you philosophically to a small extent, in the sense that I think the game is really all about taking 1 bc of industrial capacity and matching it up with 1 bc of money. All the +50% military bonus does is give you more capacity.

Isn't this really a math point? tetleytea's remark makes me think about where my math studies broke down--real calculus. I agree that the balance of income and production capacity is crucial, but for larger map players game time is a significant factor.

And that doesn't even touch on how dependent your income is on things like population size, morale, and hence tech level and misc. planetary improvments and/or resource mines.

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> but for larger map players game time is a significant factor.

You mean that it takes too long to micro & do all the math on a large map?

To clarify what I meant, I should have said the game's about getting as much industrial capacity as possible, and matching it up with as much money as possible. Lots of industry/research + lots of money = victory. Victory is the end. An economy in overdrive (at least, relative to your rivals') is the means to that end. Everything else is the means to getting the economy.

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Philocthetes

Join Date 10/2003

+153

You mean that it takes too long to micro & do all the math on a large map?

Nope. I mean that I agree with your basic point about a balanced budget being a bare minimum, but when a game is long and includes many, many planets, both your income and your ability to spend it are very dependent on your tech level and the state of your infrastructure.

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I like military production, it's one of the better abilities. But I prefer economy, morale, and population growth.

I disagree with the idea that the game is all about cranking out ships. Military production is only one expense out of many in the game. You also spend money on: social production, research, maintenance on ships and improvements, purchasing, upgrading, espionage, logistics costs for starbases, some starbase modules, and trade in diplomacy. Generating more money will let you do all of these things more, and switch between them as necessary. But increasing your military production ability only increases the capacity and efficiency of one fraction of your spending. I think the bottom line is that spending ability points on the economy ability increases your income more than spending the same number of points on military production ability increases your output on average.

The exception to this would be a map on which you can colonize very few planets. In this case, your tax base is small and you could make most of your income from trade. In that situation, I might prefer abilities in trade and military production.

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Im sure Id love to have a miltary production bonus, but would it really be worth picking up to the exclusion of the economic bonus? Especially when the military thing is really only benficial in the early game (by midgame you have some planets turning out large hulled warships in a couple turns, how much faster do you need?), and there are large stretches where you dont really need to be producing much out of your starports.

It seems to me, money in your pocket is anything you need it to be in any situation a ship, a factory, a technology, improved morale (via few taxes), which means more population, which means more money, which means more ships, factories, technologies, etc....and is useful every single turn of the game.

Miltary bonus is defintiely great the first 30 turns though.

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Philocthetes

Join Date 10/2003

+153

Miltary bonus is defintiely great the first 30 turns though.

The "first 30 turns" part gave me yet another greed-for-dev-time idea: how about a tech in the new bio branch that enables you to reset your bonuses once during a game--call it Planned Evolution or something.

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I probably should have said some number greater than 30...early game was the point I was making. Of course, on the hardest difficulties on maps with the default number of planets (not jacked up), it could be argued that the game is won or lost in that time period with the starting map "footprint" you end up with... which military bonus would definitely help with.

I still dont see it being more beneficial over the whole game than the economic bonus path, but Ive never won a game on harder than masochistic, so what do i know...maybe this is what Im missing.

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