I find it incredibly ironic that such a fuss is being made about the potential cheats have to "ruin" the challenge in player-created mods, considering mods are themselves a potential means of cheating.

Also, if a large number of players tell you they had to cheat to beat your mod, you should either be proud, because you succeeded in providing a challenge that's appropriate for the more hardcore players, or take it as a sign that you made your mod too challenging for your target audience.

In the end, there's really nothing wrong with cheats--they simply provide a means of enjoying the game in different ways. Games aren't just about being challenged, after all.

I'm sorry, but this whole idea is stupid. Stardock is all about letting users do what they want. You can specify all the options in every game, you can play on any difficulty level, you can design your own ships and share them, you can mod anything you want...You can even install the game on multiple computers and play it without the CD! It's all about choice and treating the players with respect. Removing cheat codes would NOT fit in with that.

Besides, I just don't see how it could solve anything. If people use cheat codes and say the game is too easy...They're stupid. That's all there is to it. People like that can be safely ignored. They don't matter. Besides which, are there really that many of them? You're presupposing several conditions: 1) Someone downloads your mod. 2) Someone finds it too difficult. 3) Someone deals with this situation by using a cheat code. 4) Someone then has the chutzpah to actually post that they found it too easy with cheat codes. Now, in each of these steps we narrow the field down so we have fewer people. For example, at step 2, if I found the mod too difficult, I'd probably forget about it and go back to playing regular games. So I wouldn't get to step 3. By the time we get to the end, the number of people actually doing what you fear has gotta be miniscule.

Cheat codes can be said to interfere with multiplayer games, but they can only enhance the experience of playing single player. If you don't like playing with cheat codes, don't use them! I find it hard to believe that the temptation is too great, that you cannot force yourself to play without cheat codes. If it's really a problem, try this: Make one or two games where you play with every cheat code there is, get it out of your system. Then challenge yourself by playing "real" games.

Perhaps a solution would be to include an introduction in your mod that says something along the lines of: "This mod was designed to be difficult, but not impossible. To get the full experience, try to play through without cheating. It may take several tries before you can win!" How's that?

lmao.

this has to be the most hilarious instance of "paranoid entitlement" i've ever seen for a game.

surely, you are kidding. this is an ironic post, right?

are you this dramatic when safeway runs out of fruit loops?

as to the "issue" (ahem) at hand--i think you are overestimating the role of "cheat-codes" in ruining the game. your argument is akin to blaming a woman for being raped because she's hot and likes to drink whiskey. perhaps that's a bit strong, but the same logic applies. whatever happened to ideas like personal responsiblity, or integrity, or even (LOL) "courage".

yes, i used the "C" word.

according to your world view, it >must< take some Courage to resist the siren song of Control-N.

i know i get verklempt every time i start a new game and the itch to ctrl-N starts nice and tight in the-area-i-dont-want-to-mentionables.

call me "johnny blue-maps". i'm the biggest ctrl-n whore this side of the GMT divide...

no, but seriously.

your quote: "but why should I spend a ton of time on a mod that will easily be defeated with cheap codes killing all my hard work?"

nobody asked you to write a mod. so why would you make your problem with "cheats" our problem? (will you write to Nestle when they decide to cut costs on chocalate chips and reduce their chips to cookie dough ratio?--why not be more ambitious, then? perhaps there are other, higher stakes issues that could use your (ahem) enthusiam...)

why not take it like a man, you know--take it on the chin without bitching about it--take the high road, if you will. the noble savage.

"he does it for the love of the game."

"he's such a gentleman!--everybody cheats on GalCiv2, but he keeps on writing that mod!" (swoon).

but perhaps you really would have a grand mal if safeway was out of fruit loops...

if your mod is good, the right people will find it and play. regardless of cheat codes. that's how these things work. quality sells itself. always has. last i checked, nobody wrote a forum post crying about the absence of shadowtek's mod. maybe i missed it? was it in a ["rigged" ]forum poll?

i'm just sayin.

grab a beer. drink some whiskey. whatever.

maybe even pursue some other avenue of creativity; something that will get you appreciated for your talents.

like, say, musical theatre acting. you could play "Judd" in Oklahoma!

[cue song, while playing with your (ahem) gun, which "goes off" at the end of the song incidentally--i'm serious, ask Rod Steiger]--->"lonely rooooooooooooom....."

then you could have a hissy fit and instead of looking lame, it'll look like you have ''high standards".

not everyone can make drama like that. just look at all the crap on teevee.

i'm just sayin...

-0.

Thats fine, glad I sparked a conversation of interest

Yet I do NOT agree with you, you seem to think, cause the cheats were already added, that they are some form of freedom of choice, sorry, but there not, there a means to a end, for all I know my total conversion mod will suck, and that makes it irrelivent to this disscussion, Obviously I hope people like it, but who knows, and this thread I started wont help matters, thats for sure lol...

Anyway, back to the point "Yet I do NOT agree with you, you seem to think, cause the cheats were already added, that they are some form of freedom of choice This is not some forum of freedom of choice, or option for people, its a means to beat every game every time.. period. They should NOT be in the game, it really has not much to do with anything other then, it will destroy the long time effect of the game and its longevity, a game that could keep people interested for years will be defunked in a year.

I KNOW people will use cheats, thats human nature, and YES cheats will arise everywhere, hell, I can tell you how to add money to yourself and fool the... well anyway, my point is NOT about me, Im sh!t and mean nothing, but its about game replayability, modding and such.

AGAIN I'll say it... Just because SD included cheats with the game to defeat it on any level, does not make it a freedom of choice that Im some communest trying to destroy everyones fun. Cheats will be the downfall of longgevity to this game.. period. Its a common story, it happens all the time, give every one the means to beat the game without a challenge, and a game dies, by adding the cheats themselves, there promoting them.

Yes I understand that you have a choice, Yes I understand that it can add fun to a few peoples game, yes, yes, yes... I get it... But I DO NOT agreee, SD should think about there long term sales, there mod support, and the replay value of there game, and for everyone that spends allot of there time investing in it.

As many of you pointed out, you can hack the game anyway, so why do you care if your so skilled lol

Saying my point of view is stupid shows how you play the game... have fun with that... dont let me see a post on how easy the game is from you.... as you have revealed how you play... not that theres anything wrong with useing the SD certified cheats..

SD My offer still stands, I'll pay you to remove the CHEEEEEEESE from the game

ST

@ onowak .. get a life... its a post on a opinion.. if you cant handle it, go pester someone else....

REMOVE ALL GAME CHEATS!!! Please...

To be honest, you must understand that in this world there are always some people who can't accept losing. The main point we should focus is how they face losing and what they are going to do after that. If they don't check out why they lose but just blame that it is not their fault and they are innocent, I think they should first have a talk with their holy god. Tell you truly, I sometimes use cheat but that is for a warning to myself to notice someone who has those characteristics.
I think most players are honest, especially those are playing online game, but you can't deny that there are cheaters everywhere. You ask the companies to remove the cheat codes, cheaters create trainers or other programs. I think you better ask those cheaters why they cheat or perhaps you should have take a psycology course to understand why.
Save your $500, to help others who need it indeed.

Shadow tek you need to grow up and stop offering money to people to fix your problems, learn your lesson as it is taught here and in the world, cheating is an unsatisfying way of completing a goal in the entertainment realm its as simple as that. The reason cheats exists is not for your dumb ass but for those others who are looking for easter eggs and who truely need the help. Offering money to stardock might be better spent on getting yourself some therapy.

Oh and by the way stop trying to ruin the game for others by thinking your influence is stronger then any others. I.E. A much better slogan would be for you to get on the MP bandwagon so that stardock takes notice, and allows me to whip your cheating ass, online.

Dan Greene you seems make cheats like easter eggs that help you win. And also suffering becomes deserving.

The game is fully moddable - great allows you to do your thing. It also allows another form of so called cheating whereby various files can be changed ... do they stop this as well, and therefore stop you being able to mod?

At the end of the day if useing the codes floats their boat why worry ?

Any dork who then claims its easy is so obviously full of the proiverbial that they are hardly worth the crediblity of a complaint...... and they are not exactly hard to spot. The other 99% will play legitamately, and get on with their life - they sensibly just ignore the silly egotists.

Those that use them for what in their eyes is fun - well why not? its not the end of the world..... if it makes them happy, great, another happy soul in the world - too few these days.

Dont take it too seriously - the remaining 99% - the silent majority - are greatful for the mods, enjoy them and move on - they totally ignore silly people who use them to wantenly deceive. If someone comes up saying its too easy - and its clear cheat cods have been used, ignore the fool, everyone else does itys poiuntless pointing out what all can see. Their 'its easy' post holds no credibility or kudos - forget em, concentrate of having fun with the next mod - not working up to heart failure lol

Regards
Zy

Oh and by the way stop trying to ruin the game for others by thinking your influence is stronger then any others. I.E. A much better slogan would be for you to get on the MP bandwagon so that stardock takes notice, and allows me to whip your cheating ass, online.

Dude, why would you think that? I have no influence here man lol, Ive done nothing here but post sh!t like this, Im posting my opinion on cheats, I dont know anyone here, dont know any mods, nobody. Im not trying to rui anyones fun. Im sorry you feel that way. I dont see cheats as fun, but, I feel bad now after reading your post, of course as reading your post, I dought you would have a chance in MP lol

But as this topic seems to bother allot of people, I will drop it. I did not post this to piss everyone off, I posted it as my opinion, I posted my opinion as strongly as I could to make my case and many have posted a equally strong opposision to it, and Ive had fun reading them, unfortunatly, there are those, who are unable to hold a intellegent conversation, as they panic at the thought of the cheat codes vanishing (see above) and dont consider the damage to this great game in the long term on this.

So I will drop the subject, and stop pressing for my point of view (Offer still stands SD )

Cheat codes ruin the game.. for everyone, players, modders, especially new players, and IMO for Star Dock thats my opinion, sorry some dont agree, and I respect those that dont. . glad at least a few of you did agree lol, anyway, I'll stop as I made my point.

ST

@ onowak, your post was a troll post, I stuped to your level to respond (I couldnt resist, but I should have refrained, Im a bit buzzed and amused, plus I like the comedy attempt)

Anywhoo, I made my point, so not much else to say on the matter other then reacting to other posts... which everyone has a right to post there opinion.. so as Im done with this thread as its run its course, feel free to rock on with it

ST