Neilo Neilo

MVL Round 3

MVL Round 3

"The Metaverse League"

Hi guys welcome to round 3 of the League. We have a few streamlining rules this round so be sure to check them out below. If of course we feel that there are not to our liking then we can change at the end of the round, but i think we are on top of most of the bugs now and things should go more smoothly. I will point out though that there is 1 rule that i will put in place this round that can be thrown out mid round.

"in the instance of a notified and accepted non-submital, not a "no show", in a 4 man team, a back up game will be allowed to be played be a fellow team member. That fellow team member will be randomally assigned by either myself or Firebender. A non submital with no explantion or prior notification will not be granted this privilage."

Ok here is the rule changes for round 3,

Team Bonus

Fastest team game time (average) 2 BP
2nd fastest team game time (average) 1 BP

Highest team score (average) 2 BP
2nd highest team score (average) 1 BP

Individual Bonus

For this round ( the different victory types),

1 BP for fastest and highest game per victory type.

No penalty's.

All ties, in both team and individual and in both speed and score categories, receive equal points.

Where's a score is dropped in any given team, that score, though no longer eligable for the MVL submission points are still eligable for any BP they may have achieved.

Averages are calculated from the totals of submitted games divided by number of members in the team. If a player gives advanced notice of his inability to submit a game then that player will not be counted as a member of the team for purposes of calculating averages.

I will before the end of this round post a new thread that will be the MVL Rule Book. Where these changes and the rest of the rules will be outlined, but do refram from posting in that thread please.

The teams as of round 3 are,

The A-Team (A)
Pndrev
Piznit
Dethadder
Xei Win Toh
Ferrel
Dystopic

The Blade Runners (B)
Neilo
TGE
Ghostwes
MarshallOneill
Vilgan
Noctilucus

Celestial Crusaders (C)
Playjeff45
Mumblefratz
The Butterfly
Firebender
Silverbeacher

The Domination of Death (D)
Brezelius
Mottikhan
Shadow Worrior
Elwood011
Kzinti

And now round 3, and Firebender this should make you happy.

Each team is required to submit a victory in each of the 4 different conditions. Your team captain will assign each player a victory condition to complete.

3 opponents on a Medium map.

Habitable Planets - common
Planets - abundant
Stars - rare
Anomolies - abundant
Asteroids - rare (DA)
Tech Rate - normal
Density - Lose clusters

Random minors
All victory conditions enabled
Allow Surrenders
Tech trading on
Super abilities off
Blind exploration off
Mega Events enabled

For team B, which has 5 players, the captain should assign his 4 team mates 4 different victorys and then play a game attempting a victory condition of his own choosing. Now we never really discussed what happens next but my proposal is that the two games that are the same, the captains choice and one of his players, these games could be combined and averaged to give us 1 game instead of two. Provided they are both victories. This is not in concrete but a suggestion.

The other way we could go is to leave it up to the team in question to decide which game to sumbit.

Either way have fun with round 3 guys and i hope these new rule changes work out well for us.

Good luck,

The Commissioner.

75,636 views 265 replies
Reply #226 Top
Here is my submission, game from MulletMan on 9/23/2007. Not much, but didn't take much time to play this month

Reply #227 Top
Tech victory
Masochistic
8120
3 yrs
Altarian
Neutral
Reply #228 Top
Nice game Mumble...well done!!

Reply #229 Top
OK, I've tabulated the results and I'll list them here for FireBender to check against his data. This round is confusing enough that I wanted to provide a 2nd opinion. Please do *not* consider this official, let's wait for FireBender's results for that, but please check that this agrees with how everyone else sees it.

A couple of notes. Brezelius had some difficulty posting his results and made mention of a game in reply #90 of this thread but never got back with a more definite submission. There is a game under his character that fits his description in reply #90 and so I've used that game. Actually if that game were to be considered a non-submission it would make no difference in the final score because he scored no bonus points and Team D had submissions in all four victory conditions without him.

Another point to make is the confusion we had regarding Dystopic's submission. I just want to note that if his second submission were allowed then he would have tied for a 1 point speed bonus and this would have given Team A the first place team speed bonus instead of the 2nd place team speed bonus. In all this would have changed Team A's total score from 11 to 13 and changed Team C's score from 16 to 15. However this would have made no difference in the final outcome of Team C 1st and Team A 2nd, although it would change the margins of victory.

One final thing to note. In regard to ties there was only one "extra" bonus point awarded due to ties being left unbroken and that was Elwood and FireBender who tied in Political Victory speed. If we broke this tie by league submission datetime then only FireBender would have received a bomus point.

Anyway here's the data.



The A-Team (A)

Pndrev (Prostatnic Vogon Jeltz), Political Victory, 4 years, 4590 points
Piznit (ArcLightning), Military Conquest, 4 years, 32200 points
DethAdder (Metaleaguer), Beyond Mortality, 3 years, 8700 points (+1 score)
Xei Win Toh (X E I), Cultural Conquest, 3 year, 9600 points (+1 score)
Ferrel (4 20), Military Conquest, 5 years, 31150 points
Dystopic (The Blind Bandito), Military Conquest, 2 years, 18200 points

Average speed = 21/6 = 3.5 years (+1 speed)
Average score = 104440/6 = 17406

Total = 8 (base scores) + 3 (bonus) = 11



The Blade Runners (B)

Neilo (The Commissioner), Military Conquest, 4 years, 12000 points
TheGreatEmperor (The Sandwitch Maker), Cultural Conquest, 6 year, 6800 points
Ghostwes (Incitatus), Military Conquest, 5 years, 14000 points
MarshallONeil (WhiskeyTangoFoxtrot), Political Victory, 5 years, 10950 points (+1 score)
Vilgan (Vilgan), Beyond Mortality, 2 years, 5750 points (+1 speed)
Noctilucus (Noctilucus), Cultural Conquest, 3 years, 7000 points

Average speed = 25/6 = 4.16 years
Average score = 56500/6 = 9416

Total = 8 (base scores) + 2 (bonus) = 10



Celestial Crusaders (C)

PlayJeff45 (PIKE THE PERSECUTOR), Beyond Mortality, 3 years, 8120 points
Mumblefratz (Toshiro Mifune), Military Conquest, 9 years, 85250 points (+1 score)
thebutterfly (the_butter_flies), Cultural Conquest, 1 year, 8925 points (+1 speed)
FireBender (General Hawkins), Political Victory, 3 years, 6630 points (+1 speed)
Silverbeacher (Boilermaker), Military Conquest, 1 years, 15400 points (+1 speed)

Average speed = 17/5 = 3.4 years (+2 speed)
Average score = 124325/5 = 24865 (+2 score)

Total = 8 (base scores) + 8 (bonus) = 16



The Domination of Death (D)

Brezelius (Brezelius), Cultural Conquest, 8 years, 3200 points
Mottikhan (Evil Twin), Military Conquest, 9 years, 84250 points
Shadow Worrior (Blastermaster), Beyond Mortality, 6 years, 4500 points
Elwood011 (MulletMan), Political Victory, 3 years, 7820 points (+1 speed)
KzintiPatriarch (), Cultural Conquest, 7 years, 13000 points

Average speed = 33/5 = 6.6 years
Average score = 112770/5 = 22554 (+1 score)

Total = 8 (base scores) + 2 (bonus) = 10




Reply #230 Top
Dude! You gave the whole thing away!   
Drive with a little suspense, will ya?  
Reply #231 Top
Well, mumble. After checking and checking once more I have concluded that you have made a few critical errors in MVL point scoring and thus the ranking positions of teams are different then what they should have been. But then again, as mumble would know, individually checking each member's games is very tiresome and confusing. And I want to say that your list did, in fact, help point out a few errors in my version of the results also. I want to thank you for the help, mumble.

I will post later in the "Results and League Ladder" thread with the results. I shall include a link here too.

I am less then pleased to say, that after winning two rounds in a row, the crusaders have lost first place this round. Who will replace the long-time running champs?

Stick around to find out. The results will be out in just a few hours. I am now re-checking the results and then I'll verify them and finally, post them.

The crusaders have been defeated. But by who? Only time will tell....

-Fire

Reply #232 Top
Dude! You gave the whole thing away!
Drive with a little suspense, will ya?
End of quote

Well I went through the whole thing so I may as well post it. Also it is good to have this done more than once as a cross-check. There are 5 pages of posts in this thread to wade through as well as checking the occasional profile. Plus my addition and division could be off somewhere.

All of this highlights the need for some more slightly automated process. Also it would be nice to have this months results and previous months results displayed for all to see in some nice format. Basically, this is why we should start working on getting the MVL incorporated into the AltMeta. I'll open up a new thread on how we can go about this. However, certainly compare what I've posted with what you have and either confirm what I have or post corrections.

One other thing is that everyone deserves congratulations for the fact that there wasn't a single non-submission this month.
Reply #233 Top
Awesome work guys..Fire let me pm me the results b4 you post so that i can check em out please....a third persons eye on the score in this round might be good.

cheers.
Reply #234 Top
Just at a quick glance, there defintely seems to be some things off in the calculation. I had the highest cultural conquest score, but no BP? Maybe I'm misinterpreting the rules though. Other things look a bit screwy too.

Also that the total base score for every team was 8. Either the teams were perfectly balanced in this regard, or the way the point system works makes the actual game scores virtually irrelevent (not taking into account the BPs).

Sentient species taste better... Sentient species taste better...

Reply #235 Top
Just at a quick glance, there defintely seems to be some things off in the calculation. I had the highest cultural conquest score, but no BP? Maybe I'm misinterpreting the rules though. Other things look a bit screwy too.

Also that the total base score for every team was 8. Either the teams were perfectly balanced in this regard, or the way the point system works makes the actual game scores virtually irrelevent (not taking into account the BPs).
End of quote


Umm, still wrong Kzinti.

Reply #236 Top
Umm, still wrong Kzinti.

End of quote


Wrong in what way? A few details might help.


Sentient species taste better... Sentient species taste better...
Reply #237 Top
There were no losses submitted and no nonsubmittals, so they "base" score would be equal when it comes to earning points for your wins, but since we were using the averages for some bonus scores, the individual scores are definitely not irrelevent.
Reply #238 Top
Ah, that clears it up a bit. Thanks.

Sentient species taste better... Sentient species taste better...
Reply #239 Top
It does look like KzintiPatriarch has the highest score for cultral win though.
Reply #240 Top
It does look like KzintiPatriarch has the highest score for cultral win though.
End of quote


I never said he didn't. The results shall be out soon.
Reply #242 Top
Come on - it will be dark in Europe before long. Be a bit more Eurocentric in choosing your publishing time, please!   
Reply #243 Top
hahaha, well the Commish is Aussie, and he's prolly asleep there (its 2am in NSW), and besides just being "dark" doesn't mean much to me, heck, in two more weeks it'll be dark where i live by 530pm (we 'fall' back to EST)
Reply #244 Top
The crusaders have been defeated. But by who? Only time will tell....
End of quote
I await with anxious breath, but I think you're pulling our collective leg here.

Awesome work guys..Fire let me pm me the results b4 you post so that i can check em out please....a third persons eye on the score in this round might be good.
End of quote
Absolutely. This is a tedious process and fraught with many potential for error, which is one reason I posted my stab at it to begin with.

Well, mumble. After checking and checking once more I have concluded that you have made a few critical errors in MVL point scoring and thus the ranking positions of teams are different then what they should have been. But then again, as mumble would know, individually checking each member's games is very tiresome and confusing. And I want to say that your list did, in fact, help point out a few errors in my version of the results also. I want to thank you for the help, mumble.
End of quote
No doubt anyone's initial version would be susceptible to error. This actually took me about an hour and a half to do between 2 and 4 in the morning. It would actually surprise me if I didn't make an error. That’s why I prefaced my post with the extensive caveat emptors. However on the flip side scoring should be transparent enough that everyone understands how it works and so anyone that bothers to collect the data will come to the same conclusion, sans error of course.

Just at a quick glance, there defintely seems to be some things off in the calculation. I had the highest cultural conquest score, but no BP? Maybe I'm misinterpreting the rules though. Other things look a bit screwy too.
End of quote
I think you are correct but we may as well wait for FireBender. He does seem to like to be mysterious. Not that there's anything really wrong with trying to build suspense but I find this confusing enough without adding an air of mystery to the process. Also the point of my post was to get people to respond with their issue/concerns. BTW it would help if you pointed out the other things that look screwy to you because it is possible that others may miss a problem that you spot.



Finally even when my stab at the score is corrected and ammended by FireBender and that result is then checked and approved by Neilo, even this is subject to question by any member of the league that doesn't understand how the score was derived.

I think I want to change what I said earlier. I actually think it's not at all helpful to imply mystery or otherwise add suspense and/or delay to this process. It's confusing enough without these additional complications.

I will repeat again that I think the next order of business of the MVL should be to get the MVL submission and display process incorporated into the AltMeta so that we can have at least some software support for this process. Certainly there will always be the need for human interaction and so there will always be the potential for error, however I think with a streamlined process these errors can be minimized.

Reply #245 Top
I can see there is no hope in apple-polishing, bootlicking, brown-nosin', cringing, cottoning up on neilo and fire, or currying favour with them, no chance that dancing attendance, fawning, grovelling, licking their boots (or whatever), kissing their feet (or other body parts), kowtowing, slavering, sucking up, toadying or truckling can do anything to make them release the results earlier.

Which is good - I would hate to think of myself as a sycophant.

And yet...
Reply #246 Top
BTW it would help if you pointed out the other things that look screwy to you because it is possible that others may miss a problem that you spot.
End of quote


I'll take a closer look when/if I get a chance today Mumble, although I am technically "working".

A spreadsheet with correct formulas to auto-calculate everything would negate most chances for errors. If someone hasn't done it already, I'll try to make the time to come up with something, and maybe other people will find it useful too.

Sentient species taste better... Sentient species taste better...

Reply #247 Top
Thanks for counting my game   - I am having trouble with my internet connection.   I didn't want to pull a "no-show". I will hopefully do better next round. The game seems to be running better with the newest update to the beta!

Brezelius
Reply #248 Top
Spreadsheets and formulas! We are getting fancy and high tech now. Firebender would get mad and say that cold, hard calculations from an unthinking computer would ruin the suspense of it all. Not to mention it would remove the drama of questioning the scoring that was tallied by a human. Or even appealing the results after they were posted!   
Reply #249 Top
i'm also an excel efficianado, i'd be happy to punch something out as well.
Reply #250 Top
lol, this is why i made the suggestion of a recording secretary in the first place (of which I'm still willing to do). With that said, while its nice to have a number of people going and rechecking the results, we also just need to let Firebender and Neilo do their jobs. This is WHY we have just the commissioner and vice-commish, so we DON'T have twenty chiefs in the room. IF there is a question on scoring or points afterwards, we can make a proper appeal to the Commissioner to check into it.