ROFLMAO CosMoe!

I think you totally misunderstood what i am trying to say. So i am gonna be a little more clearer;

When i said that QoT is OP it was sarcastic kinda. As u can read in my post, i call every demigod  in the game OP.

This is sarcastic because a lot of people call OP Lord erebus and whine a lot. especially for bite and bat swarm. And my point is that yes erebus is really strong BUT every DG is strong if played right. and with this logic every Demigod is OP!!! (Sarcasm). Please read more carefully. As i already said, QoT really needs a buff. she is underpowered right now. every other DG is balanced imo. QoT needs her aa fixed and a greater damage skill. and when i say greater i mean a lot better that spike wave or ground spikes.

As for ur build, it is really good but not OP. but i think that it is well known by many players (including me) that u are the best QoT player in Demigod. QoT really needs a buff.

Please read more carefully cosmoe u totally misunderstood me.

ps. sorry for my QoT rambling

QoT isn't bad trust me. If you want I'll upload replays of me. No way does she need the buff just people who can play her.

Well right now QoT needs a lot of hard work to be decent.

theres always one that tries to defend her...

Sorry Morph, I really thought you wanted a nerf for the QoT. My sarcasm detector was off.

As long as you play against newbies, like you do.

But the fact that as QoT I win average games as QoT shows that even me a casual player can win games as QoT. That doesn't call for a buff. She is hard to play that is all. And how did this post become about how a casual player gets 50% by playing QoT. Isn't that average? Doesn't average mean balanced? Most of those losses were actually me as rook. The wins were QoT.

http://www.gamereplays.org/demigod/replays.php?game=51&tab=popular&show=details&id=96345

Lets look here.

If you lose in a 2v2 as Erebus with a UB as your partner against a TB and a Rook, you suck big time.

Thank you for defending me makeshift-D although it was not needed. If he needs to insult me to feel like buffing Lord Erebus would do the game good then fine. Now if anyone watches that replay above trust me it's not easy to be that good as QoT. I have my own replay similar. That of course is not me. But how in any way is someone that can beat A DEMIGOD THAT IS 3rd IN THE RANKINGS need a buff. If QoT gets buffed all the sudden you are going to see a QoT that is insanely powerful. As is QoT can hit well into 700 heatlh per second and still do constant damage. Thats more than any sedna could hope for.

Of course thats one on one but it demonstrates the point i needed to demonstrate. It just takes skill to play her but she is by far one of the most devestating demigods there is. Now don't tell me how that enemy erebus was just sucky and made a lot of errors. Watch the game from his perpective. He played it better than 99% of the demigod community could. His abilities are bite and batswarm only yet you want to buff both of those? Thats all he needed. How about buffing mass charm or mist. Instead of making his 2 most usefull abilities even more OP make his other abilities scale to them if you want him better.

LOL Xaviors! who said anything about buffing erebus dude??? Erebus is just fine.

Also good qot players are really rare. it takes a huge amout of skill to play a really good qot. QoT definitely needs smth.

A small buff, the aa fixed, i dunno, smth to make her a little easier to play.

Oh and btw that replay is also a perfect example that erebus is not OP as people claim and whine that he is. Erebus is balanced imo.

Could you be a little more specific please Makeshift-D??

"But the fact that as QoT I win average games as QoT shows that even me a casual player can win games as QoT."

Your argument here is not strong at all. Your arguing that even a casual player can win with QoT. Anyone could win with QoT but  it just depends on who you vs. Ive also won with QoT, but thats based on having good team mates and the skill of your opponents. I have to thank my team mates for carrying my QoT through the game coz without them, for sure i wouldnt have won. Against any good opponent, Qot has no chance. She is too pre-occupied with her skill usage in bud form and lacks offensive capability to deter the opponent from pushing you.

"That doesn't call for a buff."

WOW, so just because YOU have won games with QoT, theres no need for a buff?!?
So then what happens is a UB loses a game?
We all know UB is a good character but its inevitable that a UB will lose at one point or another as there are so many factors to consider in the event of a UB losing a game.

"She is hard to play that is all."

Thats exactly it! Shes only hard to play because she is UP when compared to all demis. You go to www.demigoddb.com and compare her lvl 20 stats to all others. She carries majority of the lowest stats.
And another thing is that her defensive skills dont scale well mid to late game, and if your an experienced player, ull know why.

Before you talk read the title. He's talking about buffing BITE which is an EREBUS SKILL. And you are proving what I have said the whole time. I've said that he either needs the speed buff taken off or no change at all. I was trying to prove no change was needed to either character.

How do her healing skills nots scale. Bramble shield only maybe but if you even took 10 minutes to watch that replay mulch more than doubles your healing potential. So what if you have 500 less health than a regulus end game with no items. You health is based off of skills and mana which you should have plenty of.

Ub loses games because noobs get beat by him figure out he's OP play him and lose. No good UB has lost because of personal error. It's normally his teamwork *not related to the Demigod himself* or his team.

Let me specify my point. As a casual player I can win games that are casual too. Not games against noobs. Not games with stacked teams. Heck most of my games as QoT no one knows whats going to happen til the end. Against any good opponent QoT has no chance though? 3 words

WATCH MY REPLAY!!!!

Lack of offensive abilities? You have an ability that at level 10 allows you during the small duration ground spikes is active to deal over 4k!!!!! damage to a single building. Mulch does 500 damage and heals you for 1500 health at level 10 THATS SEDNA HEAL WITH DAMAGE coupled with bramble shield. If anything buff sedna. And spike wave is a very very powerful slow expecially with allies involved.

QoT is the most supporting demigod there is. If you win because your teammates thats normal. She can't hold her own in one on one in the end of most games not because she's bad but because she needs allies to help. Take an aa reg couple him with a QoT and fight an UB and Erebus. I can say that it would be a tough win if they won at all. I've even seen 2 on 3's that the team of 2 had a QoT and they won. She is by no means underpowered in any part. Just needs backup and since this game is a TEAM GAME you should have it. If you don't you probally would have lost regardless of who you were. You as any character should never be able to take on 2 or 3 demigods on your own and win which unfortunatly due to bite and batswarm erebus already does.

This post isn't about QoT. This is about a buff to erebus when he doesn't need one. He is in my opinion the standard for frontal assault demigods. QoT is a supporting demigod and is a demigod we need more of. If your QoT can't take a 1 on 1 on your side then follow her around and watch the carnage. We need more supporting demigods. Sedna just doesn't have the AoE to be useful in this team game.

so whats the mana cost on these abilities........

and cooldown and you have to compare stats cause if you deal 4k damage to a building and die it wasnt worth it

I just don't see Erebus and UB as balanced with TB and Rook.  I'm mostly a 3v3 pugger, and whenever I vs a team with Erebus + UB + either Oak or Sedna, I make sure that my team has at least 2 of those top demigods as well.  I've played with this combo vs teams that didn't have any of those 4 demigods, and despite win%, they've never been close games.  It's possible that I state this only because I play my best with those 2 demigods, but I doubt it.

mid to end game depends on durability and dps. which both ub and oak have and tahts why they are deesired in most pro games.

zavior fist - i checked yours stats through the ladder and i think uve got a lot to learn.  When i first started playing QoT i was raping with her but then as ppl got better over time, she just had no chance coz everyone knew what she was capable of and how squishy she is. so by the time you do anything your half dead alrdy coz ur made as priority by the opposition.

Brambles - late game lasts 3 secs if you lucky enough after taking a load of dmg against you. by the time your able to brambles again you dead.

Ground spikes - dont get me wrong this skill is awesome but it has its flaws.

Spike wave - mana heavy much?

i played a game with her today, trying a full on offense build. i did well early game but late game everyone just outshines her.
I ended having 2nd most kills in the game but theres just nothing qot can do to pressure opponents bak especially when u need to retreat through ur bud and prot it up.

Xaviors 1st - For me it doesnt matter if erebus gets a lvl 15 bite or not. Thats because most of the game have ended at this point. 95% of the games played in Demigod are on cataract. That means that in most games you wont even get to level 15. But some games last long (pro games usually) when this happens it really doesnt matter how strong your demigod is. You might have a UB that is level 19 and everyone else is 14 (lets say you outleveled everyone) and u can take them 1v3 with poping a sigil. it still doesnt matter. at this point what matters only is who gets giants 1st and MOST importantly who can cap lock 1 or 2 enemy portals.

So my point is that a level 15 skill doesnt matter so much. By  then you are just about to win anyway, or you need to cap lock a portal before the enemy caps yours and then you can win.

An example; In 1 game (i wish i had saved the replay to show you) I was regulus. enemies were beast , oak and regulus. My allies were not good at all. Almost noobs i would say. my enemies were not bad though. end game i had 0 deaths 16 kills, and i was level 18 and every1 was level 13. I could kill them 2v1 with my reg. even  the beast. Why did i lose? because my allies never used 1 teleport and didnt even try to cap lock 1 portal. i did my best to cap their portal and protect my portals. I couldnt be in 2 places at once (my allies were too dumb to protect the portals) so i lost the game. Just because my enemies were better at capping portals than my allies. see my point?

Makeshift-D ; Now you are comparing 2 heavy assault melee demigods with 1 defensive melee DG (rook) and 1 ranged support mostly DG (TB). How can u make this comparison?

Also OAK is NOT a pure assault melee as many people would like to think. OAK's role is combat support (an oak + 1 other ally) yes he is melee. but you are not supposed to be the frontal attacker with OAK. He just doesnt have the dps needed.

About sedna do i need to explain? Sedna is pure support. nothing more.

I want to say that the most important things in this game are strategy, skill and team-play. But because maybe my point isnt clear, Watch this replay and look at an erebus and a UB get owned by an OAK and a sedna;  http://www.gamereplays.org/demigod/replays.php?game=51&tab=upcoming&show=details&id=98946

Ok Im sure this is a interesting post but its just gotten way too large to read

Back to the original post. Bite does not need buffed. It needs the speed or armour debuff taken away.

Personally I would like to see the Bat Swarm nerfed or to disappear. Like Oaks sheild it makes him unkillable.

Then again I would like to see a lot of minor changes made... I should just mod them myself some time...

There are only 8 Demigods, if I can't compare UB and Erebus with Rook and TB because they require different play styles, what comparisons am I allowed to make?  What are your specific categories?  Isn't there a problem in balance if a pair of two very similar demigods dominate a pair of somewhat diverse demigods?

I agree that not all demigods should be equal in strength.  It makes perfect sense that regulus should lose to any other demigod in a straight fight because that is not how regulus is meant to be played.  However, I see it as a problem when you have team scenarios where there are certain demigods that are always advantageous to have on a team, while there are other demigods that are often a liability.  There's a problem when all of the "Pro" recorded games feature mostly the same 4 demigods.

Of course Makeshift. A strong Demigod combo is always the best asset to have in a game.

And also you will never see a QoT, TB or Reg in a real pro premade vs premade game. Ok not never but most times that is the case. Now about TB i have to tell you again that he is a support DG. And in a 2v2 game you are refering you dont need the "squishie" demigods (TB, Regulus). At least a sedna, oak or a qot with rook would be nice. I am not saying that all games should have 2 of the 4 strongest Demigods but at least 1.

And as you said there are only 8 Demigods. 4 of them have the "damage dealer" role or melee role (whatever you want to call it). 4 of them have the support role (mainly).

So we have 4 Damage Dealer's, 4 support>>>>4 generals, 4 assasins>>>>4 Light, 4 Dark>>>>2 Light assasins, 2 Light generals >>>>2 Dark assasins, 2 Dark generals. In theory at least it all adds up. Perfect Balance. In practice it is mostly balanced imo.

Considering you are QoT you should have at least 6k mana by level 4 which I normally can reach. Coupled with a mana potion which really isn't that expensive you last at least 5 minutes without a trip to the crystal and thats if you are doing a bad game.

Same here. And it ends the same most games. I say it's not QoT that needs the buff because all the situations in which QoT get dominated the same goes for... regulus, rook, sedna, and TB. Silence kills them all not just QoT. They all are forced back by spit with no counter. Either we fix 5 people with a buff or we fix 3 with a nerf. Which is easier? Which makes more sense. Erebus already can chase into a base and get out alive do we need all 8 demigods chasing into bases to get kills and coming otu unscathed?

LOL!!! So we just screw the endgame stuff because no one uses it. Why not do the same with QoT then. If level 15 bite doesn't matter because it isn't used then screw QoT forget it. She isn't used. It doesn't matter. You can already win with just UB, Oak, and Erebus why play anyone else it doens't matter. Just use spit, shield, and batswarm bite. Thats all you need at this point then you can win.

Agreed. This is what is needed to fix erebus. Not a buff to his stongest skill. As said before at least buff mass charm or mist and make those builds more viable.

Somebody is being a little high and mighty. Stats are still not the best. Plus most of my losses are early games. As people learn they target you. Brambles isn't your only heal. You have the most powerful heal in the game in your arsenal MULCH use it. You easily can take on a dps demigod on your own.

Spike wave - even if the mana cost was lower big deal do you use it often enough to make it matter. It's a powerful slow that is well worth at getting 1 point in in team games. Plus as QoT you should have tons of mana. 1k mana out of 9k is denting the bucket. Get a mana potion. Lets say it lets you get a kill early game and lets say your enemy was stupid and is level 1. Thats something like 700 mana for a kill that gives 500 gold. 350 gold for a mana potion worth 3750 mana. Worth the tradeoff I think.

Ground spikes - All skills have flaws where are you going with this. How big are these flaws. Sometimes towers don't place from tower of power. Thats a flaw but it's still a very powerful skill when used correctly.

Yeah you can't pressure them back but QoT is a support character. We don't need to turn QoT into another assassin general like erebus or oak who can solo assassins. Then if you need a buff and can't play as offensive QoT then play a hybrid. Offensive build is the only build that actually you can complain about. Defensive is very supporting. Hybrid supports and is a powerful debuffer. Offense doesn't have survivability. I agree buff her base stats in health, mana, and mana regen but she doesn't need that much of a buff if any at all. Stop complaining about her weakest build.

Complaining about worst builds lets talk about a UB without spit or one without ooze. Or a regulus without snipe. Or an erebus without bite. Or an oak without pentinence or shield. One skill dominates most characters too easily buffing that one skill doesn't fix it. Even all the skills out first. You don't get anywhere complaining about the worst build. Lets see if you can create a post about how oaks other 2 abilities need a buff. Or how UB's wrath needs a buff. You won't accomplish much.

Exactly thats why the top 4 characters need a nerf not the bottom 4 need a buff. And really sedna and QoT are the only support. What does erebus have thats support. He alone can take out rook, TB, and regulus no way is he support. Oak may not be pure dps but how many people value surge of faith that much. Shield is good because a 6 second invulnerability is good regardless but thats his only support skill anyone cares about.

Okay I don't need a spit lecture. I just think the cooldown isn't enough. Up the cooldown I'd be more than happy with UB even if it was only 3 or 4 seconds. I justt find it annoying as assassins who have no effective heal that doesn't cost gold to get spit again and again. I have no problem with spit but I understand why some people are angry with it.

It's people like you who make the foums so unbearable to be in. People with intrests in just sparking more agruements. That wasn't the point I was trying to make don't flame me over it.

Good post, thanks for the all of your well thought out replies.  I can agree with you that it's mostly balanced, and every demigod has its strengths, but it's not quite perfect yet.  I don't really care how Stardock goes about fixing it, I'd just be glad to see the squishier demigods have a litttle more use in relation to the stronger ones.