Dyson Sphere

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www.omegadrivers.net

interesting, but I believe dyson spheres are set up to collect all the solar energy around the star (qualifying the civilisation as a type II, which the civilisations are a later form of so I suppose it could be integrated)), not for living on especially with them being no more than one meter thick

Wh

I have been reading up on the idea of creating a star but I havent seen any post about creating a Dyson Sphere (no search feature that I can see).

What the heck is a Dyson Sphere?

qualifying the civilisation as a type II

Huh? Where did you guys come up with this stuff? Is this from Babylon 5 or Doctor Who or something?

What the heck is a Dyson Sphere?

Here is a link to a site that is a good starting point for information about theories of Dyson Spheres --- http://sfwrg.org/d005.html --- Within this site are also two links to other brief disertations, one containing a description of type I, type II, and type III civilizations.

More can be found by doing a Google search with the words Dyson Sphere.

Enjoy.

Thanks Jack. I took a look and I get it now. Now that I know what the concept of a Dyson Sphere is, I don't think adding that to GalCiv 2 would make the game better.

I don't like the concept behind Dyson Spheres, they're just mind bogglingly massive. Nononononono. Also I don't think the game would be any better for it.

(qualifying the civilisation as a type II, which the civilisations are a later form of so I suppose it could be integrated)

I have no idea what you're talking about.

For civilization types, see here: (ARGH! How do link tags work? The JScript stuff is broken and the url tags seem to end URLs un underscores! Just search Wikipedia for "Kardashev scale"). Basically, it's a scheme to classify how advanced a civilization is based on how good it is at mutilating space-time and expanding through the universe. Currently, we are awy pre-Type-I.

Having a Dyson sphere in the classical sense would make expansion somewhat useless since you'd get an inhabitable surface several orders of magnitude greater than what a bunch of planets could offer. Provided that you could guarantee the safety of such a structure, having one would mean a sudden superiority in almost all facets of universal domination, like population, production and logistics. All matters related to area coverage could be handled by military detachments without the need of colonies. All you'd need is a second star system rich on resources since you'll have used up everything in yours (including planets).

Heh, my first encounter with them were in that ST TNG episode. I guess it could be implemented in a 4X game, though I admit I never thought about it before reading this thread. Though I would guess it would be easier to do so in Galactic Civ 1 than its sequel...
Of course the problem would be if the tech and time to build this was very far in the game, wouldn't you have already destroyed the enemy civs or lost the game by then? If not, it would have the capacity for a huge population, no, make that HUUUUUUUUGE population.

Perhaps there should be a sequal to GC that concentrates on type II civilizations. Call it "Type II Galactic Civilizations". Or how about "Universe Civilizations", after all, beyond exploring and exploiting the galaxy is exploring and exploiting the universe. The story line would start after the completion of the GC tech "final frontier".


Nnnaaahhh. It would have to be so super theoretical that most people would not be able to buy into it, and the game would not sell well.

Dyson sphere were speculated in Star Trek, I don't remember the number of the movie, but scotty was rescued from the transporter buffer. Star Wars used the idea of a Dyson Sphere for the basis of the Death Star, of course it was scaled down to a resonable size for an advanced civ.
Asamov and Larry Niven both hypothisised the size and amount of material needed to build a sphere, Niven instead used the Ringworld concept instead. It has been said that to build a sphere would take all the minerals and material in the solar system as well as the ort cloud to be able to create it. As well as a civ would have to be able to transmute materials from base to what was needed to build it.
To me, the abilitiy to take any planet, gas included and teraform it to a basic livible world would be better in this type of game than building a sphere
Just my humble opion

GreatWhite

I remember hearing about a type 2 civ from a physicist that was on tv. I think we are a type 1, type 2 I think is when planetary altering is possible by a civ.

Dyson sphere were speculated in Star Trek,

That was in "Star Trek: Next Generation" in the episode "Relics".

I think what the problem is that there is no utalization of the star in this game. That can be a sore point to any true scifi fan I just love the ring worlds and sphere worlds of SE4

GC/OS2 used to have solar resources. I was dissappointed when GC1 didn't.

Personally I'd love the idea for a Dyson sphere/swarm/shell/ring what have you. As for implementing it, could you do something like this:

1. Create a sub branch of Starbase Conquest technology titled 'Dyson theory>Dyson swarm>Dyson ring>Dyson shell>Dyson sphere>Dysonian Conquest'
Give them HUGE research requirements on par with any other such game victories
{Option: the final tech in the chain 'Dysonian Conquest' could have relatively low requirements to research. This would give players the option to continue playing with their new toy, or just grab the victory they justly deserve}

2. Allow constructors to enter the same hex as a sun {as I am not a programmer I don't know how hard this would be to implement, after all suns don't have the same statistics as planets or resource nodes}. Allow the suns to be utilized as a resource {like the existing moral or economic mining stations, but again I haven't looked under the hood}.
With each additional constructor you give bonuses to things like manufacture and Influence {seeing as you are tapping more and more solar energy, and well it's rather impressive}, as well as create specific animations of the solar body as its becoming more and more occluded.


Some issues:
How the hell would you write in additional values for suns, so that it could still be stable with existing versions and third party mods? You might need to write this into an expansion pack.
An easier {but not ideal} route would be to make a new station {like the existing military/influence/economic stations in the game} and give it a large graphic taking up the whole hex. Or you could just reskin the existing stations to look more 'solar collector' like.
Yes I know none of this takes into account that the host system must be broken down to provide the base materials

Anyway I hope this idea will be looked at with some serious consideration, and in the spirit of sharing knowledge, I found some great pages on the wikipedia about the theories of Freeman Dyson, Dyson spheres, and other solar engines to spark the imagination:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeman_Dyson
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyson_sphere
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stellar_engine

Edit: Ya sucks to hyperlink, sucks to your auntie

Maybe it could be the Good or Neutral equivilant to the Terror Stars (The Drengin can blow up stars... but you can make them into a very high class planet)

That's an awful lot of effort to build something like a Dyson sphere or ringworld, when there's 300 billion stars in the galaxy, a good number of which probably have livable planets. By the time you built something like that, you probably could have colonized half the galaxy with near-light speed ships. Talking real world, not the GC2 world.

True it is a project of mamoth proportions, but it is a technology designed for use by a culture with mamoth energy needs. The point is not to go somewhere else to get your energy, it's to maximise the gains from what you already have.
Also you may note under the stellar engines link on the wiki that it is theoretically possible to move a star with the correct size and position of a solar collector/reflector. But I digress. My point is that sci fi is hard wired for big thoughts. Why not create the most all encompasing game you possibly can {that said I do favor quality and balence over quantity of features}
I could envision this tech used in drawn out games with few stars on the map, giving players with slow machines a chance to play a more epic game with a smaller map {thus taking less comp resources}. And again I am thinking of this as a possible victory path that gives non expansive cultures a chance to come from behind.

I think we are a type 1, type 2 I think is when planetary altering is possible by a civ.

Wrong, we aren't a type 1 yet. Type 1's can use all the energy on the planet, and we're pathetic at geothermal. Type 2 is where all the energy from the sun is harnessed, the Dyson Sphere is an array of solar- orbiting satelites that surround the sun, using every last particle of it's energy.

Galciv2 doesn't need energy since cold fusion provides it. Dyson Spheres are, therefore, useless.

One of these would be fun to try. One thing that i think is being left out it that all of the other planets in the solar system would be left in the dark (if they have not been used for construction)

Well, here's my Dyson Sphere and Ringworld thread...Link



-Wade

wrt using the Dyson sphere for research, this reminds me of the sci-fi book (free download) Accelerando, Link, where all the mass in a solar system gets rearranged around the Sun in a sphere of "computronium." I also think of his "Capitalism 2.0" idea when I'm researching advanced business or computer technologies.