Tolmekian Tolmekian

Twilight: Tolmekian's TechTree Fix v3.51 Release 05-10-13

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Twilight: Tolmekian's TechTree Fix v3.51 Release 05-10-13

from GalCiv2 Forums

Purpose of the mod:

 This mod addresses widespread errors in the TotA TechTree.xml files.  These errors pretty much broke many of the unique TechTrees, causing the AI to pursue a deeply flawed research strategy and outright preventing the research of many techs.  Part of the fix included rearranging a number of the TechTrees to fix the seemingly random arrangement of some techs and reduce the number of branches for the AI to get sidetracked on.  Along the way, I ended up fixing many UP issues, planetary improvements, starbase modules, and did some general improvement and balancing on individual techs.

This mod is a direct result of MarvinKosh's Space Weapons Fix Mod, which provided the inspiration.  A lot of my development commentary and good input from other modders working on their own fixes is in that topic.  Thanks MarvinKosh, Quaternus, deweyjohn, TOV, foxthree, qrtxian and all others for input and support.

 


05-10-13: v3.51 release

Update to fix some errors in v3.5. 

  • Because I forgot to mention for the 3.5 release: The Hyperion improvements (shipyard, shrinker, logistics, resupply) are now all Galactic Achievements instead of Super Projects.  No more collecting shrinkers :o, it really matters who builds these things.
  • I would also like to add a special thanks to Gaunathor for extensive proofreading, playtesting, and feedback.  His contributions have played a big part in me continuing the work, fixing/improving even more than I originally intended, and finally putting out a (more or less) finished product after all this time.  It's fair to say that without him, this mod wouldn't be nearly what it is.  Thanks.

04-28-13: v3.5 release

 

Here it is, the more or less finished product after all this time.  It's been about a year since I put this project down, so I'm a bit fuzzy on what exactly I did before coming back to finish it up.  I'm pretty sure I've got the major things nailed down, though.  Let's see:

 

  • Fixed those minor but embarrassing typos that made it into v3.0
  • Standardized the cost vs maintenance vs output ratios for the various improvement.  Now every race can be content with their own improvements and not shop around for the obvious best.  You can now upgrade to Industrial Sectors without fretting about the inefficiencies.
    • In general, costs went down, sometimes a lot.  Maintenance costs were also reduced or eliminated on many improvements.  No more taking years upon years to develop a planet only to have the game end immediately thereafter.

 

  • Made starting techs that allow a bottom-tier improvement for many of the improvement lines.  The idea being to allow the AI access to each type of improvement and allow balanced planet development - no filling up planets before researching basic improvements.
    • eg. Races that use the "normal" economic structures (banks, stock markets, etc) now start with Market Economics, which allows construction of the Market Center.
    • If you make a custom tech tree, this allows you to select the base techs for your tree without needing conflicting "history" techs to unlock basic improvements.
  • Rounded out the Temple morale improvements, so Altarians and Drath have a progression of decent improvements unlocked by various techs, starting with Spiritual Happiness.
  • Did away entirely with farms, charging stalks, etc.  Replaced them with a universal, one-per-planet improvement that gives a bonus to pop growth and %food.
  • Did away with Advanced Extreme Colonization techs.  Now only one tech is required for each type of extreme planets.
  • Now every tech tree includes the Government techs and Planetary Defense Techs.  No good reason for some races to go without.
  • Omega Research Center: Now with more awesome.  No longer just a watered down tech capital, the Omega Research Center is a Galactic Achievement worthy of the title.
    • Speaking of watered down Tech Capital . . . I watered down the Tech Capital.  Kind of.  Bonus from 100% to 50%, but it now generates 14tp on its own.  Which leads to the next point . . .
  • All improvements that give a bonus to manufacturing or research now also generate their own mp or tp proportional to the bonus.  This is to counteract the sometimes painful misplacement of these improvements by the AI.
  • The evil races (Drengin, Korath, Yor) got a lot of attention during 3.5 development due to general lack of competitiveness.
    • Now have access to all 4 types of capitals (economic, technological, political, manufacturing) or an equivalent structure.
    • Drengin got a couple new unique techs - Superior Warships and Fleet Domination - which boost stats and unlock Galactic Achievements to speed their conquest of the galaxy.
    • Korath have a new Galactic Achievement - the Aul Incinerator.  Out with the one-per-planet suckfest and in with something that you'll actually want.
    • Don't think the Yor got any new stuff, but some stuff is easier to get and the Manufacturing Vortex and Distributed Energy Matrix got pretty big buffs.
  • Sprinkled a couple speed bonuses in the basic techs to speed things up a bit.  Basically, the AI never designs ships with engines and ends up late game with ships that move 3 or 4 per turn.  Now we're looking at 6 or 7.
  •  Uuuuuh . . . I think that's the major stuff.
  • Enjoy!

TechTree Fix v3.51 with Dumb Old Minors: I did nothing to the minor races here.  If you want the same dumb minors you've always known and loved, this is the mod for you.

TechTree Fix v3.51 with Smart Old Minors: Same old minors that still won't colonize, but I added code to make them play to the best of the  AI's ability.  I gave them respectable descriptions, modest bonuses, and changed out the silly race images to reflect their upgrade.  Since they can't colonize, they'll send out a bunch of freighters and actually send constructors to grab up a lot of the resources while the majors are still colonizing.  They still get slaughtered when it comes down to it, but I've had fun watching them.  It's also interesting to see the majors make a ton of regular starbases since there are fewer resources to grab.

TechTree Fix v3.51 with MoOII Minors: The MoOII minors in this mod will colonize and behave pretty much like weak majors.  Much larger than the other mods due to the RaceImage and RaceLogo files. If you try this mod, remember to use the "quick save fix".  That is, the minors won't start behaving like majors until you save and reload.  So, start your game, quicksave, reload, and enjoy.

TechTree Fix v3.51 with MoOII and Smart Old Minors: Why not?  If you want a little variety, I packaged up both versions of the minors in one mod.  Your minors could be one, the other, or a mix of both.  Still be sure to use the quick-save fix, or your MoOII minors won't play nice.  I haven't tested this arrangement, but I can't see why it won't work.  (famous last words.)


03-04-12: v3.0 Release

v3.0 continues the work, this time focusing on starbase modules and planetary improvements, particularly Galactic Achievements, Super Projects, and Trade Goods.  Also included is a wonderful conversation mod, kindly contributed by qrtxian.  His mod fixes the errors in the GC2_Conversations.xml, so now you can enjoy all the unique dialogue as intended.

Highlights

  • All fleet modules that were removed in v2.0 are restored.  That's the fleet attack/defense and fleet warp bubbles, etc.
  • Entire Starbase Fortification branch removed.  The attack, defense, and assist modules were spread uniformly among the appropriate weapons and defense techs.
  • Enhanced Battle Stations starbase modules and added equivalent Starbase Defenses modules.
  • No more easy pickings, expect to see some well armed starbases.
  • Addressed a limitation where the AI will only use the first 100 starbase modules in the xml file.  Rearranged, removed, and edited starbase modules to ensure the most basic and useful modules are AI accessible.
  • Evil weapons and good defenses are now available at every weapon/defense level, instead of only at the end.
  • Extensive changes to Galactic Achievements, Super Projects, and Trade Goods.  I went after them with the idea that every one should be a "must have".  Costs reduced and AI values increased to ensure the AIs actually have a chance to build them, given their inability to plan planetary improvements.
  • Edit to add - All the trade goods now have a unique icon rather than a stack of boxes.  Except the Xinathium Hull Plating.  I figured that would still come in boxes.    I chose from among the unused icons that come with the game, so they may not be perfect.  They are, in my opinion, better than the boxes.
  • Two previously unused Galactic Achievements brought into play: the Life Force Extractor and Historical Preserve.  Two new GAs introduced: the Benevolent Research Center and Trade Nexus.  All four new GAs are unlocked by ethics techs.
  • Introduced new ethics techs to split up the multiple GAs and SPs unlocked by them.  Ethics techs now also provide a small bonus, so those who don't get the GAs don't waste their research.
  • Further optimizing and balancing.  My last playtests were some of the most balanced I've ever seen.  Sure, sometimes there are runaway monsters and pitiful also-rans, but overall it's pretty good.
  • All races are still set to AIPersonality 11, or Generic.  The Altarians, Arceans, and Korx default to their unique AIP when set to 11.  You can still use AIP 8 (Thalan, Human, Drath, Krynn) and 7 (Drengin, Korath, and Yor) if you want to mix things up, but there are special considerations.  First, AIP 7 is flawed in that it won't colonize outside of its influence sphere.  In order to stand a chance, you need to use Abundant Planets, Abundant Habitables, Abundant or Common Stars, and Tight of Loose Clusters.  Then, you need to Ctrl-n until you get a galaxy where the AIP 7s have enough stars within their influence.  Other than that, AIP 7 and 8 will perform pretty well.  Their research is somewhat flawed (no Xeno Ethics, for example) and they're hyper militant, but they seem to compete well.
  • Edit to add - While trying to improve the Arceans, I tested their TechTree with regular engines instead of their unique navigation techs.  I kept the navigation techs in the standard Arcean TechTree, but also left the Arcean-Eng tree in.

I think that's most of it.  Without further ado, here it is:

TechTree Fix v3.0 with Dumb Old Minors: I did nothing to the minor races here.  If you want the same dumb minors you've always known and loved, this is the mod for you.

TechTree Fix v3.0 with Smart Old Minors: Same old minors that still won't colonize, but I added code to make them play to the best of the  AI's ability.  I gave them respectable descriptions, modest bonuses, and changed out the silly race images to reflect their upgrade.  Since they can't colonize, they'll send out a bunch of freighters and actually send constructors to grab up a lot of the resources while the majors are still colonizing.  They still get slaughtered when it comes down to it, but I've had fun watching them.  It's also interesting to see the majors make a ton of regular starbases since there are fewer resources to grab.

TechTree Fix v3.0 with MoOII Minors: The MoOII minors in this mod will colonize and behave pretty much like weak majors.  Much larger than the other mods due to the RaceImage and RaceLogo files. If you try this mod, remember to use the "quick save fix".  That is, the minors won't start behaving like majors until you save and reload.  So, start your game, quicksave, reload, and enjoy.

TechTree Fix v3.0 with MoOII and Smart Old Minors: Why not?  If you want a little variety, I packaged up both versions of the minors in one mod.  Your minors could be one, the other, or a mix of both.  Still be sure to use the quick-save fix, or your MoOII minors won't play nice.  I haven't tested this arrangement, but I can't see why it won't work.  (famous last words.)


Update 01-07-12: v2 Release

After nearly a year, here it finally is.  Details can be found in this post.

v1.1 Notes:

  • Extract the zipped folders into: C:\Program Files\Stardock Games\GalCiv2\Twilight\mods  This is the pathway for my Impule-downloaded version.  In any case, put it into the mods folder in the Twilight folder.
  • The TechTree Fix is optimized for AIPersonality 11 (Altarian, Arcean, Korx, and Generic).  AIPs 7 and 10 are pretty much broken, and AIP 8 has certain issues that require me to do another round of optimization and testing for any race that I want to set as 8.  I set all races to AIP 11 in the mod.  You can change the setting, but it will change the way the AI pursues research.
  • My detailed change log is included in the folder.  I'd include it here for everyone to see, but it's a 15 page Word file.  It lists all the changes that I made to the techs, improvements, modules and issues.  It also includes every iteration of AIValue for each tech, so you can see just how many times I had to tweak some of them.
  • Additonal Highlights:
    • Fixes broken UP Issue "Add two trade routes".  It proposed 2 trade routes, then called for a vote on 0,1,2,3, or 4.  That vote was broken and didn't work.  It's now yes/no for 2 trade routes.
    • Restores 3 Galactic Achievements by fixing Tech Requirements: The Galactic Stock Exchange, Galactic Monument, and Hyper-Distribution Center are once again available with the proper techs.
    • Fixes error in some starbase modules that caused attack bonus to be misstated in the starbase summary.
    • Fixes Temple of Neutrality, which was a cut-and-paste of Temple of Righteousness.  That means the tourism penalty affected good races.  Now it affects neutral civs and not good ones.
    • Fixes Planetary Defense improvement so it now actually gives +25% Planetary Defense.
    • Fixes a number of errors in descriptions of techs and improvements.  Unfortunately, I didn't fix the error in the Temple of Righteousness/Neutrality/Evil descriptions.  They don't affect trade income, only tourism.
    • Fixes a number of errors in the TechTree xml that prevented the entire TechTree from being displayed in the xml viewer.
    • There's a few more in there.

 

modding
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Reply #526 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Quoting Tolmekian, reply 526
Other than that, what else is new?
End of Tolmekian's quote

Stardock released a new game, that's why I have a new avatar.

*crickets chirp*

It's good to have you back. :)

Reply #527 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Quoting Tolmekian, reply 526
Hi everyone!

 I never got around to were addressing the Thalan Hyperion Matrix and Torian Central Mine in an effort to curb the obscene advantage those races enjoy in the early game.
End of Tolmekian's quote

 

I just started a new game as Thalan (using your 3.0).  I'd like to know how the Hyperion Matrix is such a huge advantage.  After the HM, the Thalan can't build *any* production facilities until he plows through several months of research.  After that, the Thalan is behind and the HM is just a big factory/lab. 

Currently I'm sitting here with a single new colony that can't build anything and a home world that builds one Colony Ship every 7 weeks.  Meanwhile, the Drath next door in 5 weeks built 5 CS, two factories, and a lab and still had 90% of their original treasury.  So who has the advantage?

N.b. that I haven't played a year yet and I'm surely missing something.  I'd just like to know what it is.

 

Welcome back.  So when do we get 4.0, eh ?  :grin:

 

Galactic Civilizations III
Reply #528 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Quoting DMF, reply 527

Quoting Tolmekian, reply 526Hi everyone!

 I never got around to were addressing the Thalan Hyperion Matrix and Torian Central Mine in an effort to curb the obscene advantage those races enjoy in the early game.

 

I just started a new game as Thalan.  I'd like to know why you think the Hyperion Matrix is such a huge advantage.  After the HM, the Thalan can't build *any* production facilities until he plows through several months of research.  After that, the Thalan is behind and the HM is just a big factory/lab.  N.b. that I haven't played a year yet and I'm surely missing something.  I'd just like to know what it is.

 

So when do we get 4.0 ?

 
End of DMF's quote

Well, the Thalans always seem to be monsters in the early game, and their advantage tends to stick around.  I haven't tested it yet, but my best guess is that the Hyperion Matrix is what does it for them.  Don't know quite yet how I'd reconcile their lack of any other improvements, but I guess I'd have to do something.

 

Timeline for the next release?  After the holidays, for sure.  Maybe late January or February.  Most of the work is done, like I said.  Mostly I'd be looking at the Thalans and Torians and remembering what I did and convincing myself that it really is ready to go.

 

And that should be that.  After that, I'm playing a game, dammit.

Reply #529 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

I'm pretty sure the Torians' early-game (and middle-and-late-game, for that matter) edge comes from their overwhelmingly powerful Super Ability, not the Central Mine.

Reply #530 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

I tended to find in my mod that when I made the Central Mine more powerful it did magnify the Torians' ability to colony rush.  I was using Terran AI with them, and it tends to tax really hard which negates the Torian special ability for many of their colonies.  On the other hand it is really good at building up their planets so, eh.

Reply #531 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Most of my experience is in DL.  At suicidal levels the Thalans do indeed become monsters, and a serious challenge to the human player (which is good, I suppose) in the mid-game.   I rarely encounter them very early so it's hard to say what they're like then.

Their production goes off the charts, and I can't figure out why.  I see no remarkable numbers like Economy +500%.  If I take over their AI, the economy and research drop back to expected levels.  So I have to conclude that there is something hard coded somewhere.  Perhaps it has carried over to TA.

The Torians can sometimes be trouble, but not like the Thalans.  They just do a good job expanding, then get all righteous on your ass.

 

Maybe I should get a degree in xeno-psychology, what?

 

 

Reply #532 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Quoting Tolmekian, reply 526
Hi everyone!
End of Tolmekian's quote

Welcome back!

I also just recently returned and, if all goes well, the first beta-version of my mod will be released in the next couple of days.

Curious what you intend to do with the Thalan. The Hyperion Matrix is powerful, yes, but it is the only factory/lab they have for a long time and they can build only one.

Reply #533 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

If I remember right, the Thalans have racial bonuses to production.  That could definitely explain why they become such a manufacturing powerhouse.

Reply #534 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

The text says they "have an advantage when building factories".  Their factories are relatively cheap for the output, but until you get to high tech levels the maintenance costs are killers.  Like 12 mp yield, 15 maint.   oog!   At high tech levels they are about the same as Industrial Sectors.  Labs are similar. 

My current game the start was awful.  I was only able to expand because I managed to trade for Traditional Factory and Research Lab, something that doesn't really fit with the Thalan story line.

 

Tolmekian, did you make tech trading really difficult? or are the soft ones repelled by my insectoid appearance?

 

Reply #535 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Uh, actually I thought the Thalan factories started out being expensive to maintain and become cheaper to run without changing output at all.

AIValue increases how much the AI wants for a particular tech.  It also influences their research strategy.

Reply #536 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Yes.  Level 1 is 12 mp for 15; L2 is 12 for 10.  Labs similar.  Don't have L3 yet - they are very expensive to research.

It is Aug 2230, Painful, Huge, Slow and I'm just getting around to putting a second Manufacturing Matrix on most of my worlds.  I don't think I can use this game much, though, for evaluation since Tourism went nuts about a year ago and then at a UP meeting it was voted to "open up tourism", whatever that means.  So right now my Tourism income is 4 times my tax income at 25%.  Never seen anything like this before.  Where are all these tourists coming from, Japan?

 

Reply #537 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Quoting DMF, reply 535
Tolmekian, did you make tech trading really difficult? or are the soft ones repelled by my insectoid appearance?
End of DMF's quote

 

Uh, both?  Regular bathing wouldn't hurt, either. :P

I didn't mean to make tech trading difficult, but it's an unfortunate side effect of how I fixed the AI research pattern.  By increasing the AIValue to make the AI research in a decent way, I made them value the technology more in monetary terms as well.

 

A quick review of my change log reminds me of just how much work I actually did before walking away.  No wonder I pretty much burned out and disappeared.  Fortunately, I did actually wrap up what I was doing instead of walking away from a project half finished.  That makes coming back a lot easier.  It also means that I am basically ready to release what I have done, after a quick check-up.  That way I can get feedback while I work on the final touches.  I think I'm expecting complaints, but c'est la vie.  Off the top of my head:

- Total rework of population and how farms work

- Total revision and balance of all different manufacturing, research, and morale improvements.

- Extreme Colonization reduced to just one tech for each planet type (no more advanced colonization)

- Added government and planetary defense techs to all tech trees.  I remember wanting to give them each unique government types and descriptions, but apparently I didn't get that far.

- Yet more tweaking of values and fixing of issue and refining of details

- Lots of work to shore up deficiencies in the evil races tech trees (I think they're finally competitive now)

 

Let's see if I can run a test game and see how things fly.  If things are where I think they are, I anticipate release v3.x in the next few weeks.

Reply #538 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Quoting DMF, reply 537
Where are all these tourists coming from, Japan?

 
End of DMF's quote

Mars, actually.  Those little guys with the Roman helmets are running around looking at all the cool places in the galaxy before they perfect their Illudium Q-36 Explosive Space Modulator. ;)

Reply #539 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Quoting Tolmekian, reply 538

A quick review of my change log reminds me of just how much work I actually did before walking away.  No wonder I pretty much burned out and disappeared.  Fortunately, I did actually wrap up what I was doing instead of walking away from a project half finished.  That makes coming back a lot easier.  It also means that I am basically ready to release what I have done, after a quick check-up.

End of Tolmekian's quote

 

*sigh* I'll never catch up with my aesthetics modifications to your mechanical modifications.  Good to see you back in action.

Reply #540 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

"Regular bathing wouldn't hurt, either."

You neglect one of the few side benefits of vacuum.   In space, no one can smell you stink.

 

Here's an idea for a new tech or event: Smell-o-Vision.  Transmits odors on a subspace sideband.  Effect on Morale is random (and somewhat kinky)

 

BTW, is there any way to change the skin on this site?  X on black is damnably difficult to read.

 

Reply #541 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Quoting DMF, reply 541
You neglect one of the few side benefits of vacuum. In space, no one can smell you stink.
End of DMF's quote

In space itself, perhaps. But in a little tin can where all air must be recycled? I shudder to think.

...

How did this become a topic, anyway?

Reply #542 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

For Tolmekian about his 3.0 mod:

* Why change Korx from Super Trader?  That's his shtick.

* Is it intentional that Yor tech tree does not contain HyperWarp?

* My Move12 Constructors slow down to Move3 in Yor space.  Due to Super Isolationist?  Seems like a huge difference.  (I'm not 100% sure on the location correlation.)

* Setting the terraforming improvements costs to 0 guts the Neutral alignment.  That was its main draw.

* This is new: I was building Tech Capital.  Acquired a worthless world with a Tech Capital on it, and the one in my build queue disappeared!  That has never happened before.  You couldn't select a "redundant" tech, but it never fell out of the queue.  Maybe this is what the <AbilityType>0</AbilityType> line prevented?  (Just guessing.)

* Your notes do not mention that Galactic Privateer has been removed.

* Observation:  Trade Goods are easier trades than minor techs.  E.g. AIs absolutely refuse to trade Planetary Improvements, probably because AIValue is now 70.  That just doesn't seem right.  They'd never been reluctant to research it.  Was it because the neo-high AIValue techs got preference?

* "All instances of WillingnessToTrade removed from all techs."  Does it not work?  Would seem to be the antidote to AIValue inflation.

BTW, I just abandoned the game I was playing as Thalan at Dec 2231.  Tourism income is swamping everything else.  With taxes set to 0, espionage to max, and spending to 100 I still bank almost 2000 per week.  AIs' tourism is proportional by their world counts.  

Iconian is researching and building well.   Krynn Consulate is doing okay in some research areas, but hasn't even done Xeno Engineering, Basic Logistics, or the infrastructure techs.  I'd say he has a problem, symptom of which is that he pumps out reams of fighters.

I'll try another game shortly.

Reply #543 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Alright, DMF, let's see what I can do for you:

* Why change Korx from Super Trader?  That's his shtick.

Because with great power comes great responsibility, which the AI can't handle.  In this case, the Super Trader sends out freighters during the colony rush when it should obviously be sending out colony ships.  Changing the Korx's SA makes them much more competitive in the colony rush and, as a result, throughout the game.

* Is it intentional that Yor tech tree does not contain HyperWarp?

I can't answer that, because I didn't do it.  Or did I?  I think the game comes that way.

* My Move12 Constructors slow down to Move3 in Yor space.  Due to Super Isolationist?  Seems like a huge difference.  (I'm not 100% sure on the location correlation.)

Yuppers.  Super Isolationist caps movement at 3 when moving through their space.

* Setting the terraforming improvements costs to 0 guts the Neutral alignment.  That was its main draw.

I didn't give them anything to make up for it?  Now that's just mean.  Bottom line is that the AI doesn't know how to handle terraforming.  Having the improvements auto-build after researching the techs means some Ai planets get stuck with 20 or more weeks of nothing but terraforming improvements while there are still open squares that could be used.  If the AI grabs a new planet after researching the techs, then they get stuck waiting for all the terraforming before being able to place the first improvement.  Total waste.

* This is new: I was building Tech Capital.  Acquired a worthless world with a Tech Capital on it, and the one in my build queue disappeared!  That has never happened before.  You couldn't select a "redundant" tech, but it never fell out of the queue.  Maybe this is what the <AbilityType>0</AbilityType> line prevented?  (Just guessing.)

I think the AbilityType line was just junk code.  It's always been my experience that if you capture a Super Project while building your own, your SP in progress will be cancelled.

* Your notes do not mention that Galactic Privateer has been removed.

The GP was removed by Stardock.  Another instance of AI-can't-hack-it.  The problem was that the AI would send endless fleets after the invincible freighters.

* Observation:  Trade Goods are easier trades than minor techs.  E.g. AIs absolutely refuse to trade Planetary Improvements, probably because AIValue is now 70.  That just doesn't seem right.  They'd never been reluctant to research it.  Was it because the neo-high AIValue techs got preference?

Yes.  Raising the AIV on some techs meant I had to go raise it on others to get a balanced approach.  This became even trickier with v3.0, because I boosted the AIV of government, diplomacy, culture, and entertainment techs.  The end result is a real problem with tech trading.

* "All instances of WillingnessToTrade removed from all techs."  Does it not work?  Would seem to be the antidote to AIValue inflation.

With respect to my mod, it was unused code.  Rather than have it hanging around or, worse, trying to figure out what the developers intended with it, I removed it.  Now, if I want to use it, I am starting from the beginning and not mucking around trying to fix someone else's problem.  Kinda like I should have done with the AIVs.

I have considered using the Willingness code to address the tech trading problem.  It would probably be much easier to make the AI very willing to trade those high AIV techs than it would be to start the AIV balancing work from scratch.

Thanks for your feedback and observations!  Let me know how your next game goes.

Reply #544 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Hi, first I want so thank you for the effort put into modding the game, I can only try to imagine the work you had put into it.

I am a bit new here (to put it mildly), have been playing your mod for past week or so and really like the way it works.

Only one question - do Drengin have Counter Espionage? I have been playing a custom race with Minor tech tree and now have tried to make another with Drengin tree... got absolutely SWAMPED with spies by at least 3 AIs, 15 or so spies simultaneously (I was military leader in the beginning so probably AIs thought I needed slowing down). I managed to clear the mess up but eventually lost the game... while trying to figure out where is the CEC equivalent in the tech tree :D

So, does everybody have CEC or just some civs?

Reply #545 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Quoting LD1977, reply 545
Only one question - do Drengin have Counter Espionage?
End of LD1977's quote

No, the Drengin and the Korath don't have Counter Espionage in their tech trees.

 

 

Reply #546 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Thanks. Seems a bit unfair, since I don't see them as really that powerful.

Reply #547 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

My take:  Counter Espionage isn't all that great.  Unless you have way too much time and money, you can't build CECs on all your worlds.  They are most useful to protect a few high-value improvements, which you can do with spies.  So the antidote to spies is more spies. 

 

Hmm..  Spy vs. Spy.  Why does that ring a bell?

 

" It's always been my experience that if you capture a Super Project while building your own, your SP in progress will be cancelled."

Galactic Achievement, yes.   Super Project, no.  I've done this a number of times, though that was playing DL and earlier.

 

Tolmekian:  Why not write Brad and ask him how WillingnessToTrade is supposed to work?  We haven't corresponded in years, but when we did he was quite forthcoming.

 

Reply #548 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Dunno, I like the economic benefit it gives (at least in the mod). That compensates for the slot used and combined with massive price tag on spies (long term) it is worth it for me.

Reply #549 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Building CECs seems to reduce the enemy's willigness to fling spies at your worlds and thus reduces the rate at which you go through spies yourself.  You don't have to build them everywhere, though.

Reply #550 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Lots of good replies.

1) I made Counter Espionage Centers even less expensive in v3.x, so spreading them around shouldn't be so hard.  I forget off hand, but I think my drive to fill out everyone's tech tree included putting Counter Espionage into the Drengin and Korath trees.

2) About WillingnessToTrade, I know what it actually does.  What I meant is that I didn't want to take the time to find out the rhyme and reason behind how the developers used it to influence AI tech trading.  Given their unfortunate track record on this game, I'd lay good odds that there was no rhyme or reason and that most of the code was just sloppy cut-n-paste duplicates and untested junk.

In that light, I opted to remove it altogether and deal with it at another time.