"I'd rather be a really good one-term president than"...

Daiwa

Join Date 07/2001

+349

Absent 'high crimes and misdemeanors' (and he hasn't committed any we know of) we're stuck with him for at least one term.

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My wife, who is from the US, tells me private healthcare costs around $600 a month for a family. Not everyone can afford that.

Untrue. Health Care INSURANCE costs around $360 (less with higher deductibles) for a family of 5 (I know I priced it). health care itself costs what you can pay. If you dont have any money (or very little), that is what you pay. Health Care in America (not health INSURANCE) is a guarantee for everyone, including illegal aliens.

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Quoting synnworld,

reply 23

Most black people I know gave into obama faster then a crackhead to a crack rock. But what happens happens america has made their bed and now they must sleep.

You have a way of cutting through the crap to get to the core of the issue. Coarse, anti-PC, and 100% accurate.

Quoting Splitshadow,

reply 24

That's for what we made the impeach - remove process. (Although it is almost impossible unless 75% of the senate and house of reps deplore the president and have good reason to remove him)

50%+1 of the house to impeach. 67% of the senate to convict. But the rub is that there has to be a law that was broken, not just because they do not like him.

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This thread is so full of Joe Users it's absolutely going nowhere. Well pretty much all debates goes like this:

BUSHBUSHBUSH (dems)

HEALTHCARE IS SOCIALISM (reps)

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Daiwa

Join Date 07/2001

+349

If you don't see the logical fallacy of BO's statement, no explanation is possible.

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Quoting lifekatana,

reply 29

This thread is so full of Joe Users it's absolutely going nowhere. Well pretty much all debates goes like this:

BUSHBUSHBUSH (dems)

HEALTHCARE IS SOCIALISM (reps)

Some people can't read, or choose not to.

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Quoting HorseStrangler,

reply 25

The election wasn't just about Obama. It was also about an old man who said he wasn't a good economist, oblivious to how important the ecnomy would be at the time; who acted erratically several times towards the end of the campaign; who picked an unknow vice presidential candidate who botched most of her interviews and gave Americans little else to judge her by; and who in general didn't represent a strong enough break from his predecessor.

The election was an election, it wasn't liberals getting together and making a super candidate to jack off to like the chick from Weird Science. McCain/Palin was the weaker ticket, and it lost.

You know what the best part about all you guys pointing out how Obama has failed to get healthcare passed, close gauntanimo, get us the fuck out of Iraq/Afghanistan, be more transparent, etc.? You've bought into to idea that those things SHOULD be done. If nothing else Obama has shifted the mentality of the US from "if you don't agree with this shit you're unpatriotic, fuck the idiots who don't have healthcare, and onward Christian soliders, let's liberate the Middle East from itself" to what we have now.

He has dramatically transformed the political climate and whether or not he completes his objectives whoever comes after him will either tackle the important ones or getting harangued just like Obama, whether it's a Republican or Democrat.

Most peoplen I met said they didn't vote for him because he looked liked he was going to die while in office....I had a red face print on my head from some many face palms during the elections. Which is saying something since I have black skin!

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I had a red face print on my head from some many face palms during the elections. Which is saying something since I have black skin!

got a picture?

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Is he simply a puppet?

How much control does the President personally use? We all love the movies where the President goes "Dahm it! I'm the President of the United States of America and I say what goes!".

Looking at documentries, with Bush he had Cheney and Rumsfield, and a couple of other key players who had strong idealology. I guess they all do, one man (or woman) can't do all the thinking on everything. To how much a puppet they become, I guess only the puppeteers can answer that

Geez there is alot of Obama hate, whats really the big crime he has committed? The "too big to fail" in my opinion is kinda true, in that these businesses are the economic infrustructure of the US, sure you can let them fail but in doing so the recovery will be alot longer because new infrustructure will need to start up, and that takes alot of time.

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Daiwa

Join Date 07/2001

+349

The "too big to fail" in my opinion is kinda true, in that these businesses are the economic infrustructure of the US, sure you can let them fail but in doing so the recovery will be alot longer because new infrustructure will need to start up, and that takes alot of time.

This is certainly debatable opinion. There is nothing in history that would suggest your opinion is the correct one, however. Failure is a regular feature of a free economy and my opinion is that's a good and healthy thing for society as a whole.

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I guess they all do, one man (or woman) can't do all the thinking on everything.

I agree, but do not think Obama knows that. He beleives his own media spin, just as Carter did. And that is his achilees heel.

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Quoting Daiwa,

reply 35

This is certainly debatable opinion. There is nothing in history that would suggest your opinion is the correct one, however. Failure is a regular feature of a free economy and my opinion is that's a good and healthy thing for society as a whole.

The only way you can interpret history to prove your point is if you discount the human expenses of the Great Depression and the one which could possibly have followed inaction on Bush's part.

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Haha, well atleast you're a true capitalist of the first hour.

I think Paul Krugman had a good paper on that.

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Daiwa

Join Date 07/2001

+349

The only way you can interpret history to prove your point is if you discount the human expenses of the Great Depression and the one which could possibly have followed inaction on Bush's part.

Are you really arguing that human suffering only occurs in free-market economies? When you come up with a better set of principles around which to organize a society, do let us know.

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Are you really arguing that the Great Depression was a natural AND good(why do you guys always think natural=good) process in the economy?

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Are you really arguing that human suffering only occurs in free-market economies? When you come up with a better set of principles around which to organize a society, do let us know.

I don't have to. I already live in a country where a generally free market is regulated by the government.

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Quoting lifekatana,

reply 38

I think Paul Krugman had a good paper on that.

Paul Krugman? Ex CFO of Enron, that Paul Krugman? He has nothing good, especially anything intelligent.

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Obama has not changed a thing it was not a land slide popular vote victory it was close, liberals still are the ones who are more agressive if you say you dont agree with them. the policitcal climate is just as polarized as it ever was. look at the votes in congress they come down to democrat vs republican almost down party lines, thats means there is no change.

+1

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The Great Depression wasn't a good and natural thing, it was a bunch of people being stupid with bad things happening to them as a direct result. You don't reward idiocy with a pat on the head and a government check (lol, welfare) because they idiots. Social darwinism people: the only way to encourage strength is to discourage weakness. You cannot bring prosperity by discouraging thrift.

You cannot help small men by tearing down big men.

You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong.

You cannot lift the wage earner by pulling down the wage payer.

You cannot help the poor man by destroying the rich.

You cannot keep out of trouble by spending more than your income.

You cannot further brotherhood of men by inciting class hatred.

You cannot establish security on borrowed money.

You cannot build character and courage by taking away man's initiative and independence.

You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves.

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Well said, Splitshadow.

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Daiwa

Join Date 07/2001

+349

Are you really arguing that the Great Depression was a natural AND good(why do you guys always think natural=good) process in the economy?

Yeah, that's it.

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Splitshadow, If you considerable reasonable taxes to build roads; protect people from crime and hostile nations and their citizens; provide basic welfare services, the majority of which goes to children; provide basic education so people can rise out of their class tiers; and so on as negative and tyrannical aspects of government like some kind of Rand acolyte then I'm more than happy to disagree with you.

I read a shitload of Rand in my late teens and early 20s and could never figure out why no philosophy classes paid ample attention to her. Then I finally read one of her essays in which she cited her own fictional characters' speeches/made up actions when backing up her belief and it all became clear to me.

Greenspan put it well (he knew Rand personally btw) when he saw he'd help steer the economy into an iceberg. He essentially said that operating on the assumption that the wealthy act out of intelligent self-interest was a mistake; there is no John Galt. Not that everyone wealthy is an idiot or sought their position only to plunder and ruin the businesses they head, but clearly government intervention is necessary, aka taxes and other forms of 'theft' you decry.

Also for all the talk of the natural order of the free market there's very little mention of how wholly unnatural one person owning more wealth than thousands of others combined is. I don't dislike rich people or feel entitled to their earnings, but at some point I view the absurdity of their fortunes as fictional at best and it needs to be reined in. Pay your taxes and buy one less yacht. I'm sorry, but if you didn't cure cancer there's virtually nothing you can do that will make me empathize with you if you make over 20 million bucks.

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The Great Depression wasn't a good and natural thing, it was a bunch of people being stupid with bad things happening to them as a direct result. You don't reward idiocy with a pat on the head and a government check (lol, welfare) because they idiots.

The majority of people on welfare (before this most recent crisis anyway) were on it for less than two year fyi. Most people don't like being on welfare. It's embarrassing.

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How much is too much?

I read Obama's budget proposal today, and he will put our debt to %59 of the NATIONS GDP!!! That is over half the gross domestic product of the nation owed to debts. That would be bankruptcy for any business.

This "president" will only survive one term (if he survives at all) and the democrats that support him are all ready being replaced in polls and elections (Kennedy ring a bell?)

And Obama knows the nation is getting angry... thats why he said this.

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To get back to the OP for a moment; don't you see? Of course he wouldn't be reelected if he were a good president, because we the people are apprently too stupid to know whats good for us. Why else would he and the other liberals keep puishing issues that most Americans are against? Health care was all they wanted until MA woke up. Now all of a sudden they realize we need jobs.

Obama already THINKS hes a good president and yet the polls show his dismal approval. He thinks hes doing a great job but we need him to tell us he is.

Ever read 1984, how the gov't would tell the people one thing that was the complete opposite of what they were doing and the people still accepted it?

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