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[ATTN.: Stardock] Isometric Action RPGs

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[ATTN.: Stardock] Isometric Action RPGs

Why Bioware`s Fare Is Lackluster Today

from Demigod Forums

Besides DRM, Bioware`s games do not interest me these days because they are leaping into perspectives and gameplay they ought not.

I became hooked on Icewind Dale (DESPITE the lame/archaic D&D systems at play...) and Knights Of The Old Republic #1 because of both the depth of story and the superb action in the isometric perspective. The real-time action combined with the start-stop command of my Diablo-style party of characters, Icewind Dale particularly, was most engaging.

When I look at the stuff Bioware is cooking up now I honestly can`t be less thrilled. Its a betrayal of the perspectives Bioware made a name for itself with. They seem to be jumping into this third-person console realm and abandoning the isometric scope of their classic forefathers. Third-person can be fun, but it can also be more work; I can`t just click somewhere and send a party there, I have to ASDW my way but without the benefit of a *First*-person point of view. 3D Yes, "advance" away from isometric view No. Certainly not for every action-adventure experience. One can wish for EA-Bioware to return to its roots but thats simply not going to happen measured against all media on their upcoming projects.

I would hope that somebody else might not forget about the classic iso adventure... . Besides the lame underlying mechanical rule system (D&D!), the only thing that ever hampered the Icewind Dale/Baldur`s/Knights series was the limited range of camera zoom, which of course restricted the opportunity for ranged combat/combat at range. Of course with a Supreme Commander engine, this could be mitigated completely.

90,137 views 36 replies
Reply #26 from Sins Forums Top

Kangaxx was perfect in that he was brutally hard, but you weren't forced down some linear path of things you HAD to do in order to defeat him.  I read or saw many ways people killed him back when I still played it.

Reply #27 from Sins Forums Top

Well, since I played a mage conjuror (back then it meant you get extra spell slots at the cost of not being able to use charm spells - who needs charm spells when you can melt their heads off? They changed that in later games) I used to walk into every BGII battle so laden with protective spells, I once soloed a lich in the Underdark. Not Kangaxx though. But BGII made playing mages real interesting, it had what, over 120 spells to choose from?

 

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Reply #28 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting Mazuo, reply 1
Kangaxx was perfect in that he was brutally hard, but you weren't forced down some linear path of things you HAD to do in order to defeat him.  I read or saw many ways people killed him back when I still played it.
End of Mazuo's quote
What are you talking about? The summoning of Kangaxx is a very linear quest path, as you have to gather his remains first, from various tombs in Athkatla. That being said, I loved the Kangaxx fight initially. Of course, now I know some serious cheese-tactics to kill him. Did I ever mention how much I love my Rings of the Ram?

A much more always-interesting fight is the Twisted Rune pre-Underdark.

:p

Quoting ManSh00ter, reply 2
Well, since I played a mage conjuror (back then it meant you get extra spell slots at the cost of not being able to use charm spells - who needs charm spells when you can melt their heads off? They changed that in later games) I used to walk into every BGII battle so laden with protective spells, I once soloed a lich in the Underdark. Not Kangaxx though. But BGII made playing mages real interesting, it had what, over 120 spells to choose from?
End of ManSh00ter's quote
In contrast to the NWN games, I actually found all the classes diverse and interesting (rather than pushing for the next PRC, going through 3-or-so levels at a time before anything happened with any base class.. at a time).

One of my absolute favourite runs was a multiplayer run where I made 2 characters, intended to be twins; A elven Kensai and a elven Archer. Remember that this was back when elves had extra attacks with Longbows and Longswords. By ToB and with Improved Haste, that equated almost the full 10 possible attacks/round.

:D

Reply #29 from Sins Forums Top

is a very linear quest path
End of quote

This would be where you misunderstood what I wrote.  I'm talking about the fight.  You can kill him using all sorts of tactics and parties.  As for Rings of the Ram and laying down a hundred traps before the fight, boo.  I prefer the legitimate methods of kicking his ass.  }:)

Reply #30 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting Mazuo, reply 4
This would be where you misunderstood what I wrote.  I'm talking about the fight.  You can kill him using all sorts of tactics and parties.  As for Rings of the Ram and laying down a hundred traps before the fight, boo.  I prefer the legitimate methods of kicking his ass. 
End of Mazuo's quote
Yeah, I totally read you wrong. I read "fight", not "defeat".

:'(

Anyway, the cheese I'm talking about isn't Rings of the Ram (which doesn't actually kill Kangaxx by itself, regardless. It just does good damage which nothing can bypass) or laying down hundreds of traps (I only used a trap-tactic once, and that was in ToB, after getting Spike Trap for Sarevok). Ridiculous cheese is using Protection from Magic or Protection from Undead, both very legitimate tactics in their own right, but completely trivializes the entire encounter.

Reply #31 from Sins Forums Top

True.  Myself, I'm too scared to go install the game again and install the various tweaks to the SoA and ToB bosses to bring them up to their original planned difficulties that pretty much were set at the level to inflict physical pain on the player trying to win.  One of these days I'll do it.  Someday.

Reply #32 from Demigod Forums Top

Well, I have to say that first, the screenshot you linked to (thanks) was totally unlike all the media I`ve seen hawked for this title (Dragon Age) before. Second, you`re right, it does look pretty promising - very very much like the Icewind Dale party adventuring action I remember. I must say I may be wrong about the game.

You`ve got me caring about it now. Hopefully Bioware calls the shots on DRM for the thing and keeps things reasonable.

I`d still like to see something in this vein from Stardock & company though.

Reply #33 from Elemental Forums Top

Darklands, FFS!

Frogboy, give us a new Darklands!

 

...Ok, I'm pretty annoying, but I'm doing it for a great cause.

Reply #35 from Sins Forums Top

Darklands certainly had the best armour system & armour visuals. Really unforgiving statistical curses though (nay to 'permanent penalties'...).

Reply #36 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting WarlokLord, reply 10
Darklands certainly had the best armour system & armour visuals. Really unforgiving statistical curses though (nay to 'permanent penalties'...).
End of WarlokLord's quote

It had the best character creation, too.

And an amazing "magic" system, with Saints and alchemy.