Scott Jensen Scott Jensen

Wanted: Best solution for over-population issue

Wanted: Best solution for over-population issue

There have been some suggestions on how to deal with the overpopulation issue in the game. Overpopulation is a problem because once a planet goes beyond a certain population point, it starts having morale problems. Major morale problems. I'm sure this was meant to be a penalty aspect of the game that you're to work into your game strategy. However, it goes way too far. Quickly no matter what you do, the morale on your planets plummets. You can have all the morale bonuses, propaganda machines, etc. and it will still plummet. I would imagine the planet would eventually becomes like the world in the original Star Trek episode "The Mark of Gideon". ;p

The only way I've found and I hear others have found to take care of this is simply toss a fourth of the population on a colony ship. Unfortunately, now the problem becomes what do you do with that colony ship once all the planets are colonized? What I do is simply have them go from one side of the map to the other. Forever in transit. It is kind of humorous after a while. This massive convoy of colony ships going between the same two points forever. A friend says he just destroys the ship once it has left orbit. He says this has its humorous side as well. You've just tossed a billion people on a colony ship, there are no known planets to colonize, and you explode the ship right there next to the planet. What then happens? Morale improves on that planet. That's not the humorous part. The humorous part is... You soon need to do this again AND there's people on that planet that will get on the next "colony" ship. LOL

However, neither of these solutions is a good one. Both increase the micro-managing you need to do of the game and creates a surreal world of either billions upon billions of eternally homeless people or horrific mass slaughter.

Possible solutions to correct this issue could be:

A) Population cap on each planet. This is along the lines of what was done in MOO2. A planet only holds so many and once that is reached, population stops growing at that time. This is the simplest solution. Then when you build a colony ship from that planet and take a portion of its population off, reproduction starts back up on that planet until it hits its max again. Or if you improve the planet to enable it to hold more people, reproduction starts up again until the max is once again reached.

B) The China Solution. Your government forces only one child per couple. I would have this option be only available to neutral and evil empires.

C) Forced sterilization. I would think this would be an option that could only be available to evil empires. The empire sterilizing all criminals and, just like unwanted puppies at the dog pound, orphans. The more overpopulation becomes a problem, the lesser the crime that warrants sterilization as part of its punishment. This option could actually help improve morale since only law-abiding citizens are reproducing and they're passing along their subservient mindset to their children.

D) The Great Migration. This could be an option for good, neutral, and evil empires. You create a special colony ship that puts all its colonists in cryogenic stasis then send them off the map to "parts unknown". Now it wouldn't need to be a special ship but simply an option you could pick when double clicking on the colony ship. The ship then flies off at its normal speed in a random direction until it goes off the map. The biggest negative of having it be simply a double-click option is that this still requires a lot of micro-managing. The benefit of having a special cryogenic colony ship is that it could be something that you could automate. When overpopulation occurs on planet and there's no more planets to colonize, the game makes your next ship from that planet a cryogenic colony ship to take off the overpopulation and then automatically flies it off the map.

D) How developed a planet is determines its population growth and even decrease. When a planet has few high-tech buildings (i.e., research labs), it has a high rate of population increase. As it adds high-tech buildings, population growth slows. It eventually stabilizes. Add more high-tech buildings and it even starts to decline. You then have a problem of underpopulation. This is more reality based as underpopulation is a problem with all industrialized countries in the world today. The only reason these countries increase in population is because of the influx of immigrants. If this population increase/decrease system were implemented, I'd allow population to move amongst your planets. You allow population movement (behind-the-scenes to reduce micro-managing) and you then would need to have some underdeveloped planets cranking out people to shore up the populations of the population-decreasing highly developed planets. ;)

This last option I like the best. It makes sense and is based in reality. It still gives you a problem you need to deal with, but not one that so cripples you as the current overpopulation problem does.

So which of the above do you like best? :) And do you have another suggestion to add to the list? :D
862 views 36 replies
Reply #26 Top
Another option - (maybe simpler to implement in the short term) is if you could research a technology which for fun we'll call: "planned parenting". Once researched it would make populations self stablize based on the planet class and morale. I understand the community is supose to be able to make custom technologies fairly easily? Granted maybe it can't tie into population growth beyond giving overall +/- modifiers.
Reply #27 Top
Some ideas:

1. sell the population as slaves to other empires...
(Evil only ....) Increased production for the buyer, money for you

2. new galactic wonder: The ringworld project (artificial world). MASSIVE ammounts of money and resources have to be spend to build this wonder. Afterwards excess population is send there. Population stays at an optimal level.) This new world is political neutral / independent.
Reply #28 Top
I'm confused; I never have this sudden morale drop issue. Is it in the way-late game? All my plantes just stabilize at 52% morale.
Reply #29 Top
Combat transports with 5 billion people each very quickly relieves population pressure and have an obvious use ;) Of course it's arguable if it should always have a positive morale effect though (especially if those 5 billion people die for any reason). It might be interesting to have a morale factor based on losses of capital ships (not fighters, drones etc) and population (due to invasions, events, col/trp ship losses).

Generally speaking, government-enforced methods at limiting population growth have been massively unpopular and often circumvented in various ways. I find that it adds to the game that this pressure exists, if it was self-balancing it would just be another step towards "Press ENTER to let this game play itself".
Reply #30 Top
The troops on transport ships, aren't they loaded from planet populations? In that case, the best way to deal with overpopulation would be to draft everyone in the army :)
Reply #32 Top
_______________________________________________________________________
Citizen Daveman on 3/31/2003 9:12:55 AM said

I think the best solution would be to introduce a plague spread by dirty telephones.
_______________________________________________________________________

Not if your enemies had develpoed and inflitraed your planet with "telephone sanitisers" who would control the plague and keep your population up and your moral low. Muwahahaha !

Elrikk ;)

*HGTTG reference manditory!


~SDC~
Reply #33 Top
They could simply dumb down the link between morale and over population by a certain amount. That way they don't have to get rid of the idea, just refine it.

Ohh, and you shouldn't be able to scrap any colony ship with colonists on it, without shifting your alignment to evil. And even then it should have an effect on morale since you just killed a billion or so people.

~SDC~
Reply #34 Top
Possibly a sliding scale. At a morale of 50, population doesn't move at all. From 51-60, a slight increase. From 40-49, a slight decrease. Up to 100 morale causing huge increases, and 0 morale causing massive decreases.

That way, you could use the tax rate, propaganda and morale improvements to balance out population and morale.

~SDC~
Reply #35 Top
I would just like to know how the computer player keeps its pop growth in check, I can only assume its by taxing them heavily (This will keep down pop growth if tax is above 40 by a lot).

This game needs ton's of buttons similar to the influence button but even more detailed and everywhere, even on ships so we can know why I have a 37 attack dreadnaut producing from a captured civs capital
Reply #36 Top
LOL OK, I've found a solution. In fact, it kills two birds with the same stone. Literally kills. LOL

I set my military spending between 10-15% and let the rest be equally split between social and research. All planets not needing to build another type of ship build colony ships. I just keep these parked in orbit.

When I need a new planet colonized, I toss 100M into a colony ship and send it on its way. WARNING: If you toss in a % of your planet's population on a colony ship, you'll get a red frowning face on the new planet instantly. 100M seems to be the ideal colony ship population.

Ever so often, I check the morale levels on planets. If any are close to 50, I simply dump a quarter of their population onto a "colony" ship and then explode (a.k.a. disband) that "colony" ship in orbit. Next turn, morale on that planet is back up to at least 66.

As for producing needed ships, I simply don't spend all taxes and thus have a surplus. This enables me to buy such needed ships about when I need them. Basically, the government expenditure bar BECOMES my military bar. Give it a try. It's real easy to start viewing it that way once you start taking this approach. And when you don't need a military ship, you simply increase government expenditure take of taxes and it fires up your social and research production.

Another nice thing about this strategy is that small planets don't build any colony ships. Check their shields. Nothing. By setting military spending so low, the game doesn't give small planets any shields. Essentially, you've just been able to set military spending on that low population planet to 0%.

Still another nice thing about this strategy is that the colony ships are slowly built and if you work the military % bar (the real one this time) properly, you'll have a "colony" ship ready just shortly before you need it to take care of overpopulation. Oh, and if you already have a couple colony ships there, simply have the planet slowly build a military ship and you'll have a military that all other civilizations will fear. ;)

And yet still another nice aspect of this strategy is that you'll be cranking out new tech developments so fast that your social build queues will never be empty ... even on your most productive planets!

Now is the above a good idea? HELL NO! It is a stupid EVIL idea. We're talking about regularly repeated mass slaughter afterall ... and, even more stupidly, it doesn't affect your good-neutral-evil status. However, it does help deal with two major problems in this game: wasted resources and overpopulation/morale. I suggest it only as a temporary solution until the game designers fix these two problems.