But its forever and ever right? Look, even if you play galciv 2 DA forever and ever (a very awesome game), playing it forever would quickly become your worst nightmare. You do believe Hell is eternal with no escape from Hell once you are in Hell, correct?

Yes, we will. The capitalistic marketplace will follow the money to a different solution. But it will need to be cost-effective and all the options we currently have are more expensive than gasoline powered internal combustion. but we'll find a way. We always do.

You know, I had the slightles inkling that you weren't criticising me either right before I sent that post. Sorry I reacted that way.

I hope not, but everything we know , every little bit of western social life relies on petrol.

My cart and ox was a joke, eg the lol, but what is to replace air travel. "electric planes" powered by fission reactors.

A world built on petrochemicals is doomed to end, and we haven't thought of technology to replace it.

What I believe - I'm not saying this is correct, I'm responding to a question about my personal belief - is that we are all sinners and condemned to eternal Hell. There is nothing that we can do on our own to change that. Jesus changed that for us, and if we believe in him then our sins are forgiven and we are saved, by grace alone. I'm a good little Lutheran boy.

I try very hard to remember that what I am believing in is by some definitions a folk tale and that other folk tales might be just as compelling. I am not sure that mine is the only way to salvation, but I believe that it is mine. Does that answer your question?

Relax, Marcus. If we had to, we could run everything on ethanol. It would take some modification, but we could. Modification costs money, and we don't want to spend the money.

We are "hooked" on petroleum-based fuels because they provide fairly high energy per liter and they are easily transportable. It's convenient. Once it gets costly there are many other things that will work. Brazil is running on renewable ethanol right now.

Is God dangerous?
Now thats a question.

We all hope for purity from our gods, don't we?

Maybe, many things are not certain.

God is surely the perfect being?

God therefore is without pride.

Surely, then If so, why can one think that this deity, God, would condemn anyone too hell,
For the sin of non belief?

Surely this is pride? Or at the very least arrogance.

Why should we believe in sin?

Maybe if God exists, nobody is worthy.

Agreed. Now all we need is for people to regain the backbone that made our nation great and pour all of our resources into accomplishing it.

If we can create railroads and roads that crisscross the country, we can change our cars.

And IMHO, we shouldn't just go part of the way with hybrids - no, I say we go all the way with electrics.



Well, I seem to be stuck on Earth for over twenty years, without it becoming a nightmare. I had a relative that loved to be over a hundred, and she didn't describe Earth as a nightmare.

I wouldn't describe Earth as a paradise - it's full of problems. But it seems I can manage to get through it with my head on straight.

Obviously hell is going to be worse than Earth, but the point is just because there's a lot of troubles for a long period of time doesn't mean you're automatically going to go insane.

In any case, even if I'm wrong, as I've said on the other thread, we send ourselves there. So apparently we are the ultimate evil, not God.

Bravo. If IRAN gets a nuke they WILL use it.

If al Queda gets a nuke into the US, the WILL use it.

Maybe if we have 50,000 dead instead of 3,000 the liberals will wake up. I woke up when my friends died 9/11/01.

I disagree. George Walker Bush, Osama bin Laden, Benjamin Netanyahu, Kim Jong Il. Korean Dictator are not that dangerous except maybe for Putin. Though they all have power...it is limited. Their actions are monitored and in many ways scutinized by other countries and media networks.

Especially in the US, most modern presidents have to deal with world issues and conflicts that impact America only because of the consequences of greedy corporations. Heck...corporations have already brought the presidency...we given a choice of 2-3 people. Some descent average Joe will never amass enough money to campaign.
In wars countries go further debt, but companies rake in the dough...from funerals...to all the companies that involve in building sophisticated weaponry. Corporations will squeezing pennies from starving thirdworld children and they don't give a f*** which people they stomp on. The greed and the bottom line don't discriminate, no matter what color, age, people, or country (as long as you're not a significant shareholder).

I think it is the board members of the largest corporations in the world are the most dangerous. Such as Monsanto (agriculuture/biotech seeds); Federated Department Stores (Macy's, Bloomingdale's, Foley's); Merck, Pfizer (pharmaceuticals), electronics companies, Procter & Gamble (consumer goods), and off course multimedia networks. Many brand names you know are actually own by more obsure company names...like Pizza Hut and Taco Bell belong to Yum! foods.

A hypothetical example...Macy wants 5 tons of shirts in Burma by 7 months. They subcontract to the lowest bidder knowing fully well at that low price...it not enough for a typical factor worker to support his family, but they turn a blind eye. So what happens? That subcontractor whom have even less morals than Macy...hires any desperate able bodies (there are many desperate able bodies...and they're expendible...that included kids, young adults, whoever. These people work 80hrs a week, basically force to lived in cramp filthy quarters near the factories. Of course their rent, water, utilities, uniforms, are all deducted from their meager salaries whether they lived there or not. If some got stick from the flumes, chemical dyes, well we just let them go and bring in the next desperate soul. Current American laws mandate that Macy inspect the health and welfare of it's subcontracter workers. So Macy does a quarterly inspection that last about 5hrs or a day. The subcontracter simply threaten it workers to smile say nice things, clean up the place, or bring in healthy children for a day. Now if some brave reporter managage to break the story. Macy will simply claimed...it had no idea and will find another subcontracter. How you think these people feel about American companies and America afterwards?
Let's stay some rich Islamic extremist open a free school in this same area where most of the people are too poor to enable their kids to go to elementary, or any school. THey provide basic grammer, language and teach why America are the devils and must be rid of. Interesting chain of events.

All of the EU or pretty much Europe ban genetically modified food, meat, milk...yet the FDA says it safe...no harmful evidence (yet). Speaking of milk...you ever wonder about all those milk ads on tv, magazines, everywhere. That's Expensive for a milk company. The govt sure isn't paying for it. Milk companies aren't known for raking in money. What if milk is a final result of a company's product say rBGH (growth hormone)? The reporters that broke story of rBGH were fired...because monsanto's advertisement make significant income for the station.


With agriculture...in many third world countries there's just too many middlemen. Let say Starbucks wants 5 tons of coffee beans a day from a country it doesn't want to deal with thousands of individual farmers. It want to make a contract to one or two people. So coffee beans has to go through a dozen middlemen before a sufficently large quanity is matched. THat means the individual farmers are paid pennies per pound and that price goes up and down on a daily basis with the stock market. Starbucks could spend some time and effort send a representative...tell farmers to gather their friends and farmers and purchase directly from them at 20cent per pound instead of pennies. Cut out the middlemen. Usually it a 20-50cent difference that enable's a third world farmer to put meat on the table more frequently and school for his kids.

Corporations only look at the short term...10 year profits. They don't concern themselves with collateral damage, people, or environment...buy cheap land in some thirdworld country and dump toxic outdated electronics there...so what if the rain washes mercury, cadmium down some river that reaches a village. So what if the weather patterns are increasingly chaotic around the USA? There's money to be made...like taking candy from a baby.

I am a big supporter of capitalism, but it needs to instil in its roots some humanity and morals because the long term consequences are going to affect us all. There's a good way to do business and there's the used car salesmen approach. Stardock isn't out there to make a quick dollar, Stardock actually listens to its users.

Funny how that kind of changes your views, huh? And sorry for your loss...



Macy's? Macy's is detroying the world? Hold on a second - who is buying the cheap shirts that the little Cambodian kids are losing their lives to make? We are! Are you willing to pay $75 (or whatever it would be) for a shirt that was made in the US by a union worker when you can buy the same shirt for $19.99 at Macy's.

The answer is clearly no. That's why those jobs went overseas. And what would the Cambodian kid be doing if he weren't making shirts? Sitting in a gutter filled with raw sewage starving to death because there were no jobs.

You can't win.

we are winning.
Those poor stupid fools, working for £15 a month. making our goods.

I call that a win. don't you. this is capitalism at work, the western dream striving forward delivering cheap somethings to us.

Do we care that some kid in some shitty hole we never heard about loses his chance at education?

**** him and his chances as long as as we get our stuff at a competitive price.

Who gives a ****, there not our kids.

But what if they were?

The reason Mythology appeals to me is it helps me to better understand the world I was born into. I insist that I was innocent and completely without any "sin" at the time, however I have learned how since then, thanks a lot. The main tools I learned to use from the mythology books I read is metaphor and how it is used in myths, and to try to understand the metaphor in the context in which it was used.

For instance this famous religious metaphor: " ... created the world in seven days." Nowadays we all know that the world wasn't created in seven days, but then on the other hand, what is a "day" to the creator of the universe? Probably something like 500 billion billion Human lifetimes. That makes more sense, and is probably much closer to the truth ("The Truth will set you free"). What better way to get a village full of ignorant, greedy, selfish, and probably stupid peasants to start to understand that there is a bigger universe out there without having to educate them for 2000 years in advance? It might have been the only thing they could handle, mentally. So having information about the context of the situation at the time is crucially important to understanding.

As far as what "we" can do to fix things ... The only thing I can see for me to do is to refuse to lie, refuse to cheat, refuse to steal, refuse to be a bigot, refuse to repress other Humans, and etc. I will never accept a job with a company or corporation that rips people off, or decieves them, even if I have to starve to death first. In the larger sense, that of the world-wide community of Humans, I see these anti-social (and in many cases psychotic) behaviors as the root cause of all our ills, and that just isn't "what God expects of me." It may not seem like much in comparison to the "evils that men do", but "even the smallest person can change the future." If everyone, or even a small majority, would just stop acting like ignorant, greedy, selfish peasants and do the same, we can have Paradise, Heaven, or whatever your local myth calls it, right now, right here, on this planet! We don't have to wait for "pie in the sky", we don't have to wait for someone else to tell us what to do, we don't have to be ignorant and manipulated by the "smart" ones.

"The Kingdom of God is spread upon the Earth, and men do not see it."

Sorry if I said anything, in this or any other post, that caused any discomfort. I only meant to express myself.

Marcus, please be more careful with your language.

Sorry kryo. I will in future.

A sad truth is that the crummy job they get in the sweatshop is better than no job and hunger. These people are not being driven into slavery - they are fleeing abject poverty.

Do we find their working conditions acceptable? No. I don't find 8 people living in 400 square feet acceptable, either. As they get more opportunities and more jobs, which are created by our demand for goods, their standard of living will increase. We are the solution, not the problem. It just takes time.

I see some very biased and uneducated comments about Russia here, very very biased, almost to the point where I am insulted.

We have a lower standard of living true, but we arent dirt poor.

It is a lot harder over there, but that is why a lot of us go to other countries for work and then send back money.

In my opinion life was better in the Soviet Union, at least for the hard workers, dispite what the 'capatalists' say, there was incentive for work. But, it wasnt money, no. It was better housing, better food, better clothes, better everything. One problem is that everyone couldnt really support those 'hard workers' the economy bottomed out when Russia just couldnt export because it didnt import, the value of the dollar dropped and boom the largest depression in our history.

When I left in 1999, it was 6 rubels to 1 dollar, our economy was still pretty strong. Now it is about 30 rubles a dollar, I dont really think democracy is working. Do you?

Okay, so we covered the past. Now the present. The eastern half of Russia, the one in Europe is actually finally comming out of the recession. For two reasons, one increased tax revenues and harder money policies from the influx of earning that a lot of the populace do in either working more than one job, or going to other countries and sending money back. The area from about our eastern border to Moscow and arround St. Petersburg is as good as any other country when it comes to the standard of living. If you have ever been to Moscow its like you never left America, sure it looks a little bit more rag tag, but the country as a whole is still suffering.

So its pretty much up to Putin now, however he does have a power hungry side to him and Russian spending in the millitary has gone up. Not to mention that the strict millitary draft policy is still entact. So... he might prove dangerous, but Russia's a federation and a lot of states at any time can break away, just like they tried at arround its fall.

Correction: We hypothesize that the world isn't created in seven days. Unfortunately, our distant past is one of those things that cannot be directly examined, so what we have are all kinds of guesses as to what really happened.



Unfortunately, such a thing is impractical - there are always those who will mess things up .

If Al'Qaida get their hands on nuclear weapons, they likely will use it, probably in Europa as it would be easier to get it there-

However, I have some serious doubts whether Iran would actually use nukes if they had them, because I think the Iranian government and military would be scared of the retaliation. I think it more likely they would only utilize their bombs as political leverage against the USA and Israel, in the same deterrent purpose as Pakistan (also a muslimic country btw) uses theirs

As I have said before, maybe not here. But, their president is obsesed with power, and doesnt want to use it. Sure he a maniac but he isnt stupid.

Now what I see happening might be a nuclear terrorist attack but that is also very unlikely. Its just too hard and risky to giver over a nuclear weapon to terrorist with little scientific knowledge. For all you know the might accidently detonate it while still in Iran.

While I tend to agree with you, it's still a big chance - I'd rather not find out the hard way if we're wrong . . .

And frankly, I'd like to see the list of nuclear powers get shorter, not longer. I think countries ought to be trying to get off the list, not on it.

No,

Israel is of course not beeing provocated as her neighbours knows Israels military is powerful enough to wipe them all out. What would be the use to provoke such a powerful neighbour?

It is of course the other way around.
It is Israels that is continuously provoking her neighbouring countries by cutting of roads, using powerful weapons destroying entire buildings because of what the Israel states , MIGHT hold terrorists ... Why not just sending over a squad of elite soliders to elinimate the terrorists then?
Becouse demolishing the building using Tanks and Artillery is more PROVOKING as it most certainly also kills many civilizans.

By provoking her neighbouring countries, witch of course responds promptly to this kind of provokation, the Israeli goverment creates a feel of urgency in its own people.
A sence that "enemy is everywere and absolute loyalty and dedication from the people is needed and everyone disagreeing or asking questions can be considered a terorist".

Well, of course the enemy is there! It´s just that the enemy is created by Israel itself. The situation is not entirely different from the situation US is having in Iraq.

US desperately need a reason to stay so is acting in ways witch actually helps, not hurts, terrorism.
Staying sequres Oil. Oil secures US economy and Economy ensures people get to keep their jobs. As long as the Economy is running well, the common man won´t mind that much about the fact that iraqis civilizans are beeing killed by the thousands - a fact well known by those beeing in charge.


Not suprisingly thus, an European poll were ordinary European citizens were asked about witch countries they thought were the greatest threats to world peace, showed that accorgind to the Europeans, the biggest threat to world peace is in fact was Israel.
(the top five dangerous included. Israel, North Korea, Iraq, Iran and the USA)

Umm, I dunno what planet you live on, but sending soldiers into a foreign country is called an "invasion" and most countries I know of would certainly take it as being more provoking, not less.

In addition, I think Israel's neighbors are interested in taking over and getting rid of Israel - or did you forget about the controversy over Gaza Strip already?



Terrorism is certainly not going away because we leave, so I really don't see that we're really helping terrorism as you claim.



Please define the word "civilians." And, of course, cite your sources for your statistics. Lastly, who is doing the killing? More than once, I've found that the statistics were composed of mostly the terrorists killing civilians, not the USA.

Yes, that is why the US does it all the time, especially in Europe. I mean we even have secret torture centers there, on land we dont even own.



Ofcourse they are interested, what would you do if your people were pushed off their lands just so your greatest enemies could move in and take over.

Plus, its not like Israel is the good guy either, they bombed a UN base in Lebenon during that conflict, a very well marked UN base and killed 3 peacekeepers.

They also bombed several cities and towns killing hundreds and only allowing terrorist groups to encourage more to join because they helped rebuild the cities.



Yes, you are right its the terrorists who are doing the killings, but why are they doing them? Because we are there, because we took over, because the Iraqis now rely on us to protect them. We are causing the carnage there.

And we dont really capture many terrorists before the go boom, then its too late. Most of the terrorists are capture by foreign agencies when they try to cross over into Europe.

Something doesn't have to be original to be worth saying.