MarcusCardiff MarcusCardiff

The most dangerous people alive.

The most dangerous people alive.

Just an opinion.

I think these are quite possibly the 5 most dangerous people alive.

By this I think these are the top 5 people that could potentially be the most dangerous to human lives. by global instability, Whether directly or indirectly.

NO SPECIFIC ORDER. Just a list.



George Walker Bush, American President.

Osama bin Laden. Al-Qaeda leader.

Benjamin Netanyahu or Ehud Olmert. Israeli leaders, (I'm not exactly sure who is pulling the Israeli strings)

Kim Jong Il. Korean Dictator

Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin, Russian President, Soon to be dictator.

This is my opinion, There are some others and hundreds of reasons why.
I cant fill reams of text with those so I am happy with just 5
225,746 views 402 replies
Reply #76 Top
Agreed. Unfortunately, we're sorta placed in a no-win situation, because many of the insurgents are Iraqi. We're caught in a civil war.


Yea, starting to look more and more like Vietnam. Except that the insurgents don't have the kind of backing and recources that the Vietnamese comunists had. so where South Vietnam lasted several years after America pulled out, against a powerful and proffesional military force, hopefully the Iraqi government should be able to do allot better because they are not facing an organised and powerful military force.
Reply #77 Top
I am still confused, whats with the last one.

I know hes an ex-communist and quite the socialist, but dangerous, I dont think so. I would worry more about the generals and the members of the cabinet than him.
Reply #78 Top
I am still confused, whats with the last one.

I know hes an ex-communist and quite the socialist, but dangerous, I dont think so. I would worry more about the generals and the members of the cabinet than him.


Yes and no. With the collapse of the Soviet Union, Russia doesn't pose any sort of economic or military threat anymore. Problem is, socialism doesn't work and communism doesn't scale, so the Russian people are going to end up right back where they were under Soviet rule - dirt poor.

If Putin becomes a dictator, however, he could pose a threat to his own people.
Reply #79 Top
I am still confused, whats with the last one.


Perhaps Russia at the moment can be compared to the Jews in the desert (Mosus's time).

Wandering in the desert for so long they began to wonder if they were better off back in Egypt. Likewise russia might one day begin to wonder if they would be better off back under communism?
Reply #80 Top
This may seem a bit off-topic, but it isn't. I just can't resist any opportunity to share something with people any chance I get. I saw a few indirect references to what are actually the results of mythologies at work in these posts. The people that are so denigrated here are perhaps victims of a particular mythology they chose to follow that encompasses the destructive instead of the constructive. Sympathy for them? No. Compassion, yes. Here is a link to a website (clean and useable) that gives a little tip on starting to really understand what these people are accomplishing (or not) and a deeper look at why they are so f.... up.

http://www.jcf.org (The Joseph Campbell Foundation dot org)(Professor of Mythology and respected scholar in this area)

Also he wrote many books, but the best two to learn more are "The Hero With A Thousand Faces" and "Myths To Live By". May Buddha bless you with enlightenment.
Reply #81 Top
The people that are so denigrated here are perhaps victims of a particular mythology they chose to follow that encompasses the destructive instead of the constructive.


Interesting. While I wouldn't necessarily attribute it to any sort of mysticism (there are other more likely explanations), I do agree that it's counterproductive to point fingers at any single person and engage in defamation.
Reply #82 Top
I do agree that it's counterproductive to point fingers at any single person and engage in defamation.


why is that? This is a discussion thread, and probably a complete waste of time regardless of what is discussed! hehehe, we are here for entertainment primarily so i do not think it is possible to be counterproductive when there is nothing productive in the beggining??
Reply #83 Top
The most dangerous people alive.


Lawyers.
Reply #84 Top
Mysticism is only one small part of a mythology. For example the myth that, sooner or later, we all have to kill each other in some kind of ultimate orgy of violence called Armaggeddon. It's all bs, of course, but for someone who chooses to believe that, it kind of limits them to ultimate self-destruction, so they become a victim of it. An example of a mythological result mentioned here prior to my post would be the vietnam war, where the "western mythology" and it's expansionism small-print authorization clauses led to the actual deployment of troops and the application of force to defeat the "communist mythology". Whereas my point is, once someone puts on the monkey suit, they start acting like monkeys .... personally I prefer a mythology that recognizes and enforces human rights, opportunity, rational discussion without bullying, etc, but then I'm not a war pig.

Reply #85 Top
why is that? This is a discussion thread, and probably a complete waste of time regardless of what is discussed! hehehe, we are here for entertainment primarily so i do not think it is possible to be counterproductive when there is nothing productive in the beggining??


Mystik,

I'm really beginning to like you. even though we disagree on most issues so far, I still have to say that I like your attitude.
Reply #86 Top
The most dangerous people alive.


Lawyers.


YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Finally some real wisdom on this forum!!!

Kill all the lawyers!!!!

I actually heard today that some scumbag judge is sueing a local drycleaners for 65 million because they lost his pants. Now sueing them for maybe $100 or whatever the cost of the pants were, ok reasonable. but 65 million????

Its so amazing how ignorant we are. Many of us are a bunch of money grubbing whores. Its ok to be well to do, but suing a drycleaners for 65 million??? How much money do we really need? Does anyone on this planet need more than say $500,000 a year??? I think it is selfish to make more than that per year and keep it to yourself.

Of course I suppose this judge will get it in the end with an eternity of Hell. The wrath of the most depraved seriel killer is nothing compared to the sheer PURE WRATH AND EVIL OF GOD. Just ask any Christian!

If you believe traditional Christianity, then the answer to who the most dangerous "entity" is obvious - God.
Reply #87 Top
how many terrorists struck American soil before 9/11?


Ok, how about the Oklahoma City bombing, the attack on the USS Cole, a prior World Trade Center bombing in 1993, and the destruction of the marine barracks in Lebonon.

To name a few that come to mind.
Reply #88 Top
For example the myth that, sooner or later, we all have to kill each other in some kind of ultimate orgy of violence called Armaggeddon.


Very interesting. From what I can tell, most older religions have some sort of deity destroying the world - the idea that man does it to himself seems pretty recent. It seems that the new Armageddon is global climate change.

The wrath of the most depraved seriel killer is nothing compared to the sheer PURE WRATH AND EVIL OF GOD. Just ask any Christian!


We already discussed that. If you want to discuss it again, bring the old thread back to life.

personally I prefer a mythology that recognizes and enforces human rights, opportunity, rational discussion without bullying, etc


Agreed.
Reply #89 Top
how about the Oklahoma City bombing, the attack on the USS Cole, a prior World Trade Center bombing in 1993, and the destruction of the marine barracks in Lebonon.


Oklahoma we did to ourselves (well, I mean it was a US citizen), but, except for that, good thought. Anybody want to say that we aren't in a war?
Reply #90 Top
Ok, how about the Oklahoma City bombing, the attack on the USS Cole, a prior World Trade Center bombing in 1993, and the destruction of the marine barracks in Lebonon.


well, let's see. Oklahoma City was an American dissident. a terrorist to be sure, but a home-grown one: how does war in Iraq help prevent his flavor of terrorism?

USS Cole: not U.S. soil. i'd say if it hadn't been docked in Yemen in the first place, it probably wouldn't have happened. as for the Marine Barracks in Lebonon, i honestly don't know if that was technically U.S. soil. in any respect, it doesn't make it less vicious even if it's not, but i don't see how going to war in Iraq would help prevent attacks against military resources abroad. once again, it's not the terrorists we're fighting there.

and the '93 Trade Center bombing: there's one seemingly legitimate case. okay, now contrast it to U.S. military action taken over the same period of time in the broad region for which Al Queda feels it speaks. all this still side-steps my bigger point:

there's a huge difference between the service the armed forces provide generally, and the reasons behind this particular deployment. if it were about really defense, the'd do a much better job defending me from the home front, not from halfway around the world.


the war in Iraq isn't preventing terrorism. that's a job for the CIA. i'll agree to an extent with what Oz said, that the war in Iraq might prevent Al Queda from sinking its claws in (though that seems like a hindsight "another good reason" thing, since we went there for WMDs). however, what's stopping AQ from setting up shop elsewhere? people from Moroco to Malaysia, Southern Russia to Central Africa, are mostly Muslim, and they're mostly in similar enough economic conditions that AQ might well find harbor anywhere in that region. AQ needs to be beat with espionage and cooperation, not brute force.
Reply #91 Top
but a home-grown one: how does war in Iraq help prevent his flavor of terrorism?


Good question. And it probably doesn't. If anything, our current actions are probably encouraging domestic terrorists.

USS Cole: not U.S. soil.


No, but still an Islamic extremist attack on an American asset.

as for the Marine Barracks in Lebonon


see above

'93 Trade Center bombing: there's one seemingly legitimate case.


Yup.

OK, so there is a pattern of extremist attacks against American assets throughout the world, primarily in the Middle East. The Middle East is where the oil is.

if it were about really defense, the'd do a much better job defending me from the home front, not from halfway around the world.


This could be the crux of the problem, and a central question of the Pax Americana - do we stay on our side of the ocean or not? Our assets wouldn't be attacked if they weren't spread across the world, but isolationism is not the solution either, especially now. If we leave all of our foriegn committments in an effort to increase our domestic protection we have tacitly handed AQ the victory they are fighting for, the removal of the great US-Satan while leaving the rest of the world to try do defend themselves against the extremist threat. If we do that we run the risk of, ten years later, facing an entire Arabian sub-continent in a secular war, not just Iraq. And this war will be taking place on top of the oil. That risk is unacceptable.

there's a huge difference between the service the armed forces provide generally, and the reasons behind this particular deployment.


"We contend, however, that war is nothing more than a continuation of political intercourse with the mixing in of other means."
- Clauswitz

This deployment is an (imperfect) expression of our historic domestic policy. We feel that tyrannical dictators should be overthrown, that people should be able to govern themselves, and that a stable government is a good thing.

And if you won't listen to us, we'll drop bombs on you until you do. Especially if you pump oil.

Is our domestic policy wrong? That is probably what the 2008 election will hinge on.

the war in Iraq isn't preventing terrorism.


No, but it's killing terrorists. Other people, too, sadly.

that's a job for the CIA.


No, the CIA should be trying to put a bullet into Osama bin Laden. If we made that part of our stated policy that could have a huge impact. We said that we would fight any nation that harbored terrorists. Maybe we should just say we're coming after the terrorists, wherever they may be, with any means neccessary. Which sounds kind of like a counter-jihad...

people from Moroco to Malaysia, Southern Russia to Central Africa, are mostly Muslim, and they're mostly in similar enough economic conditions that AQ might well find harbor anywhere in that region.


The brutal truth is what is stopping them is the wreck that we made of Iraq. That is a terrible sign of our strength, determination, and will. That should make people less willing to support AQ. Those could be there houses that were flattened.

This would work if we are vocal about fighting the terrorists. I think we get bogged down in nation-building and that is when we are criticized for tampering with other nations. Probably what we should have done was get Saddam and hand Iraq to the Bath party. But hindsight is always 20/20...





Reply #92 Top
Mystik,

I'm really beginning to like you. even though we disagree on most issues so far, I still have to say that I like your attitude.


thanks!

Of course I suppose this judge will get it in the end with an eternity of Hell. The wrath of the most depraved seriel killer is nothing compared to the sheer PURE WRATH AND EVIL OF GOD. Just ask any Christian!

Actually according to basic Christian teachings, that judge will suffer the same fate as a serial killer or even somone who is practically a saint (but who dousn't accept Jesus as his saviour)!

There was a good saying i heard once, the difference between a truely evil person going to hell and somone who is almost a saint (but dousn't accept Jesus as his saviour) is that the evil person runs and leaps off the cliff but the good person just steps over the edge.... it is the same cliff, same result.

If you believe traditional Christianity, then the answer to who the most dangerous "entity" is obvious - God.


Personally i do not believe this basic Christian teaching on hell. I believe that God's justice is perfect and i do not see perfection in the above 4 parragraphs, therefore it must be wrong.

Edit: i somehow put my own remarks in the quotation highlight.


Reply #93 Top
Dear Stanley,

The most dangerous people alive shall no be lawyers but in the end be the people theselves and there arsortment of parallism to stupity and uneducated minds of old. AS FOR THE CHRISTIANTIY DO NOT SPEAK UNLESS YOU ARE. What do you think of when you say traditan christanty? Do not codem someone in your mind to hell because of a injust act you do not know him and are not in his mind hold your fingers on the keyboard.  

Sorry for bad spelling
Reply #94 Top
Edit: i somehow put my own remarks in the quotation highlight.


So, are you saying you don't agree with yourself?   

I can't wait to watch you debate yourself!
Reply #95 Top
For example the myth that, sooner or later, we all have to kill each other in some kind of ultimate orgy of violence called Armaggeddon.


Very interesting. From what I can tell, most older religions have some sort of deity destroying the world - the idea that man does it to himself seems pretty recent. It seems that the new Armageddon is global climate change.


Yes, like Shiva, Destroyer of Worlds, from India. You are an intelligent person, obviously. You would probably benefit tremendously from reading the books by Joseph Campbell I mentioned in my earlier post ("The Hero With a Thousand Faces", "Myths To Live By"). As I remember, perhaps not perfectly, Joseph Campbell touched on Shiva and thats how I learned Shiva destroyed worlds when it was time for them to go (every few hundred million years or so), not to be a "boogey-man" to scare the people into passive compliance with government policies and power-mad monkeys' whims. Unfortunately for us, the Human Race, many of the "religious" myths, especially western religion, are corrupted (subtitle 'hypocrasy') and are now used mainly to exploit and control people to benefit the special interest groups in power.

How many billions of the dollars spent in Iraq are going into the pockets of those who own the companies that do all the transportation and supply of the fuel, food, water, and etc.? How many of those people (the beneficiaries of all the spending) pushed for war with massive contributions to the campaigns of politicians who could make it happen for them? How many hundreds of billions are being spent for new military equipment contracts, which is provided by corporations and companies that, on a daily basis, send their lobbyists into the capitol with fistfulls of spare change to spread around, thereby sidestepping the democratic process and taking away our voting power?

... and all those people are simply doing what they think is best, according to the mythology they believe in. Climate change is just an accurately predicted result of careless development without caring how many people die to achieve the ends. What an absolutely horrible mess. Shiva old buddy, maybe it's time to start over.



Reply #96 Top

and the '93 Trade Center bombing: there's one seemingly legitimate case. okay, now contrast it to U.S. military action taken over the same period of time in the broad region for which Al Queda feels it speaks. all this still side-steps my bigger point:



What about the two embassy's in Africa?
Reply #97 Top

and the '93 Trade Center bombing: there's one seemingly legitimate case.

What about the two embassy's in Africa?




Reply #98 Top
I can't wait to watch you debate yourself!


Your talking to somone who can play chess with himself!! hehehe Dousn't everyone debate with themselves? I thought that was just a natural thing?
Reply #99 Top
I'd say the most dangerous people are those that pay attention to the media and politicians, and actually believe what they say.

Alongside them are the people who think that 2000 year old stories of a bogey man in the sky, whose words were interpreted by warlike bigoted hate mongers and placed into a badly written series of books...... That accounts for all of the faiths that originate in the middle east.

If every one was a Buddhist, I'm sure the world would be more peacful
Reply #100 Top
I came back in to add a postscript when I saw yur post, dragoon. You, my friend, are emminently wise and correct.

So, can I sneek my P.S. in here?

For those of you who didn't know, the professor I've been mentioning, Joseph Campbell? He had a little bit to do with helping to produce the original Star Wars movies, way back when.