You just assume that everyone thinks Vista is horrible and that MS is the Antichrist

That's funny, I don't remember saying any of that. I said I wasn't interested in it, and mentioned some of the philosophical differences I see between Vista's development and previous SD titles. I wouldn't like to see those ideas implemented in a future SD product, so I become concerned when I see vocal support for a product that contains them from a company noted for not implementing them in their own software. That's it. If you're looking for a ravenous MS hater you're going to have to find someone else to argue with.

It's pretty much been clarified now that that won't happen, and that the Vista piece is largely related to WinCustomize and not the gaming end of SD. That's fine, and pretty much terminates my interest and concern in the whole affair. I sincerely hope I haven't angered anyone too much in the course of setting my own mind at ease, but that's really all I was trying to do.

1) No, most people DO NOT know their PC specs. Look how many people literally dismissed the "Your video drivers are too old to play this game. You MUST update them." dialog and then posted how buggy GalCiv II was? The numerical performance rating system is really quite nice.

I'll bet you anything you like that having a number there won't change a thing as for as ignoring warnings then complaining about it is concerned. People refuse to read the most basic popups that scream at them it won't work if they ignore it.

2) I think more and more people will be playing their PC on their high-def TV in their living room. The GAme Explorer makes doing that much easier for average users.

Can you further explain what the explorer actually does? I can see people sitting at their screen to play a game, but most games install their own launch icon. Launching an explorer to launch a game is... pointless, if the game already has a double-click launch icon.

And I don't agree that anyone will be modding a game from their TV screen, or rummaging through it's directories while flicking through their favourite adverts. I still don't see the point of it. Is it a DL manager/launcher/update manager/etc like SDC?

3 has been covered by my earlier post

4) DirectX 10 is a pretty major update. I'd argue that MS should be getting paid for it. We charge for expansion packs. MS has been giving away DirectX updates for years now on XP (DirectX 9 was a pretty big improvement too). DirectX 10 isn't a big deal for us, but for first person shooters, it's a pretty big deal.

I don't play FPS. Yes, it looks like a major update. I don't like that it's vista only at all, and DX10 is a reason not to get vista atm, when you see the price of the only DX10 native cards.

5) Having a desktop that is already a 3D surface means that game developers can make 3D games much easier. Right now, it takes quite a bit of effort to make nice looking casual games. I can think of quite a number of casual games that dont' exist right now that are possible now that I can do 3D on the desktop using WPF.

I'll concede that, since I don't know much about 3d development.

But the other 4 points are still bleh, and the only reason I'll get vista, as I said, is dx10. This is nothing to do with vista's performance at all, and if I could get dx10 on XP, there would be no time I'd ever get vista. I just don't see the point of it as an OS.

So go ahead, reserve your right to hate all things MS. I just think you are ignorant of both the law and business realities

And you're just an ignorant asshole, to be honest. But I reserve my right to hate you too. Microsoft are the leaders in the market but their products are annoying when they simply refuse to do what you want. Right now, I'm attempting to fix a computer that had basic errors starting with bad PBR. They've continuously escalated and for some god unknown reason windows is now quite sure that the hard drive doesn't exist. Hooray.

And vista is an overpriced overhyped piece of crap, from what I've seen.

And as for your "get a life" comments, response being "go lose yours" jackass.

This got ugly fast, but who couldn't forsee a anti/pro MS war coming. As soon as I saw it on the front page I was like "What the hell?!?". It's not so much a hate of all things MS. I'm typing this on a $75 Microsoft keyboard that I've had for years without a hitch.. They make some good products, it's just as much their method of getting everyone on board that angers me and so many others. Microsoft knew that people like us, that know computers and are avid gamers, would never upgrade to something so limiting and controlling of your PC. Their solution was to essentially make it where if you wanted to play new games, you would have to have it, like it or not. They basically targeted the power user to ensure we would have to get Vista. This was not the case in the past. I happily went out and spent $200 on XP not long after it came out. It had it's bumps, but is now perfectly stable and I can play all my games on it, even ones designed all the way back to 1994. I have a snowballs chance in hell of getting a lot of my older games to run on Vista. There was no worries with XP. I can reinstall it forever if it gets unstable. They have created a situation where they could potentially just code it to only last so long before going haywire, in order for you to keep buying it. There's to many things to list about Vista that is uncomparable to XP or other past versions. If piracy is such a problem, wouldn't it cut into those billion dollar profits.

Another thing that shows Microsoft's domineering nature is the fact, in todays world there is a lot of products that have multiple packages. Microsoft could have easily offered a "no frills" version to people who like us. I believe it would of sold quite well. No instead we are not only forced to get it at some point or another, but we have to deal with a slew of unwanted "enhancements". Their underhanded business practices have, in the past been directed toward dominating market share by going behind the scenes and dealing with vendors and manufacturers. Seemingly bailing out the competition while actually controlling it. Vista has brought this practice right out in front of everyone, because at this point they are so confident and control the market to such a degree that they just no longer care what we think.

Perhaps it doesn't for you but it most certainly does for me. I'm proud to hate Microsoft. I despise Microsoft more than Republicans despise Hillary Clinton. I loathe Microsoft even more than Democrats loathe Bush.

It is rare that I get to see you so 'passionate' about something Mumblefratz, especially this. Your rant was definitely well thought out and pretty much pushed right on through to the heart of the issues.

Vista has brought this practice right out in front of everyone, because at this point they are so confident and control the market to such a degree that they just no longer care what we think.

And DethAdder, I believe you hit the nail right on the head with that one.

I don't think Vista benchmarking is going to solve any real problems. From what I know, it rates your computer by the worst part in in, while the games get rated by the most dire requirement.

Some additional facts. MS recently launched Games for Windows campaign. It's official site links to xbox.com everywhere and even displays XBox controller on the main page. It also links to Dell site that in turn links to xbox.com. Obviously, MS wants everyone to upgrade, preferably to 360.

[quote="frogboy"]like Windows Vista. It's a good OS. Why shouldn't I post some of the cool new things they've done in it that will benefit gamers?
Vista is not that great in terms of solving real problems. It's mostly about pushing forward some values. To me it seems that GalCiv2 is a game that was based on the opposite values. It's not about graphics, it's compatible with older windows versions, it's complex in a good way, it's a game that couldn't be ported to consoles.

Vista might benefit some gamers, but I doubt it's going to be GslCiv2 userbase.

Vista is just another step in the direction of hiding any and all significant OS function on the pretense of making it "easier" and "simpler" (why does this remind me of "kindler, gentler machine gun hand"). I don't want a Media Center. I want to know what files I have on "my" PC and where they are without having to Google for them. I don't want cartoon character puppy dogs or paper clips to "help" me. I want a start menu that’s clear, concise and usable without having to hide a bunch of crap that I don’t want by using personalized menus. Yes, I do want to be shown hidden files and folders. No, do not hide extensions of known file types. No, do not hide protected operating system files from me (Yes, I *am* sure, you flaming a$$h0l3). No, I do not want software error reports downloaded to Microsoft. No, I do not want Windows to automatically check for every new POS update that Microsoft chooses to spit out. No, I do not have .NET Frameworks installed on my new PC. Yes, I specifically uninstalled it. No, I do not want to apply the 133 security updates to .NET Frameworks that Microsoft has deemed to be critical to my system performance.

Couldn't agree more!

The only good thing about Vista is that it might make me skip XP altogether and upgrade from Win2000 as soon as it'll prove to be necessary. As long as I upgrade my machine at the same time I shouldn't lose much performance...

Why did no one freak out when Brad mentioned Dominions 3?

"OMG!!! BRAD WANTS HIS COMPANY TO GO UNDER BECAUSE HE IS PROMOTING BUSINESS AWAY FROM STARDOCK!!!!"

where was that reaction? we all applauded his guts to advertise for a 'competing' game that he liked, why the heck is his comment on Vista any different EXCEPT for the fact that it is MS? MS has played dirty and won, and they are are reaping the benefits, but before you cry "rape" re-read that post about intellectual rights, i don't like it any more than you do, but its true. we want to give microsoft the finger? fine, lets all sacrifice gaming, sell our current rigs, and by a Mac, seriously, if the whole gaming community up and went to mac, how fast would developers port their stuff on over do you think?

I swear, the one thing i hate more than blind bigotry is people who whine and don't do anything to change it... i used to whine about MS and windows, seriosuly, I HATED IT. and I changed, I used linux for a while, i even supported transgaming (there is a REAL alternative for you) but you know what? Linux has a lot of growing pains to go through before it will be accepted mainstream. and Macs? they don't have the popular tech savvy support of gamers. so what are we left with? personally, I don't know. personally, i'll stick with XP till my next hardware upgrade, at which point I may sitll stick with XP or i'll switch to Vista because I hate the complication of building my own rig, it always seems to go wrong no matter how high quality the parts i purchase are. *shrugs* so i take the easy route, does that make me a lamewad MS lover? i hope not. it does make me a realist though, here is my reality, I like ease of use in a computer, and I like games. those two factors mean its windows for me until Mac or Linux get their act together.

Let me know when that gamer petition to switch to Macs starts circulating, i'll gladly add my signature.

What the hell? Does Gal Civ II run under Linux? Damn, if it runs under linux I could move to Linux as a primary OS. BTW - Microsoft is not so bad. Why does the Enter key not work in the reply box?

it does, you just have to double tap it sometimes

as to GCII running under linux, i would assume that yes it does. I got the demo to install with Cedega just fine, but it wouldn't run, most likely because I had a built in gfx card on that machine and through emulation it lost all its slim chance of running any 3d games (was great for Fallout though!)

seriously, check cedega out, www.cedega.com

and just FYI, Cedega supports many windows games, including but not limited to -
WoW
CivIV
The Sims
Diablo II
Half-Life/Steam
'insert game name here'

okay wait maybe that last line was a lie, but they have DX9.0C emulation up and running, so if your willing to fiddle a little bit with settings (menu dialog settings, not linux kernel) chances are you could get most of your games to run... somewhere on their website they also have a list of games and their current status

EDIT: Cedega = transgaming = WineX for anyone who heard of the project way back when and wondered where it went.

I will never ever buy Vista or a PC which comes bundled with Vista.

I already have dual boot with Linux. Wine WWW Link">WineHQ made big steps forward in the last month and even directX 10 is not out of range WWW Link">WineConf 2006 (search for "Direct3D10").

The Wine developer are very helpful and willing to fix issues. Many games already run out of the box WWW Link">Wine Application Database including some of the most popular and latest state-of-the-art games.

Are there any Linux Geeks at Stardock? It would be a great step forward to make Stardock Central and GC II running on Wine and I doubt that it would cause too much pain. You could start with an unofficial project and I'm sure that there will be a lot of committed testers. I personally would be very please when I could help in any aspects.

I know that Brad is somehow a burnt child due to the demise of OS/2. But IBM can't do the same with Linux. Currently Linux is on a roll and with Vista this will get a great boost.

I know that Stardock lives from products for the Windows desktop and that this will no change but it is nothing wrong with having a second horse in the race.

1) People said they never would for all the previous Mitrosoft versions... I don't hold much faith in that.

That said, If it comes down a choice between getting Vista or not getting new games. Not getting new games would win. They don't make enough good games in a year for any to feel like must-purchases, and there's enough older stuff that is suitable "replacement goods" Also, the good games tend to be ones with the lower technical specs. Games with high tech specs on PC usually suck, unless it's a high RAM requirement. (Reason: It's a good sign they are going graphics over gameplay)

Heh, there's always Virtua Fighter 5- which I may pick up an X360 or more likely Japanese PS3 for... (yes I see the hypocrisy, but I don't care)

Currently Linux is on a roll and with Vista this will get a great boost.

i would love to believe this, I could even almost believe it if I hadn't been burned by the hope so many times. the fact of the matter is linux is not yet viable for the average user. until someone simplifies the system down to the level of windows or mac "click this button and wait this long" type processing it will remain out of reach. Windows, like it or not, works on whatever hardware (that meets the minimum requirements) that you slap it onto. Linux can run into so many issues because of the wide range of hardware it runs on and the non-unified support base for said hardware inside the linux community. Macs are the flip side of this coin, hardware customization is totally non-existant and thus it runs so tightly that it rocks, but you cannot custom build a mac like you can a windows or linux box (X86 mac version hacks aside).

the fact of the matter, in my mind, is this, Mac has such a closed system, the OS cannot help but one tightly and smoothly with fewer devs than windows. Windows in comparison runs on almost anything you can put together without blowing up, what is the result of this? the system is bloated with hundreds different devs coding all different projects trying to integrate them into one solidified system. for as much as I hate the OS for all its fault, i have to give props to the fact that they have managed to do it succesfully for so long (yeah yeah, i use the term 'succsefully' rather loosely here). Linux is stuck in between, with millions of people working on it but not enough focused a single unified system, you have Gentoo, Ubuntoo, Mandrake, DSL (damn small linux) just to name a few distros, with literally dozens of GUI's, KDE, GNU being the most prominent among them. but almost none of this is unified! and so supporting the same wide range of hardware as windows become hard as heck, while maintaning the friendliness of mac also becomes hard. when someone pulls as many devs for a single linux OS as windows has, or they start limiting hardware (impossible for an Open Source distro) I doubt linux will ever live up to its full potential for home use

Very nice, Marcathonas. You clearly understand how to resort to pointless ad hominem attacks to disguise your poorly reasoned and illogical arguments. You clearly have your own (misguided) opinion about Microsoft, which you are quite entitled to. What I find most objectionable is the complaining that SD actually mentioned Vista on the main GC2 site.

From what I have read, do I hate vista? Absolutely

As a PC Gamer will I buy it - Well, I will have to won't I? But I will hold out until the bitter end.

A good chunk of Vista is MS's attempt to woo the Media companies to get into bed with MS. Did you know that Vista spends a lot of CPU cycles so that it can spy on you? It literally does an internal poll over and over again to make sure you are not using some sort of dodgy hardware that will allow you to copy that protected medium (Ha! The joke's on them - HD and Blu-ray security have already been bypassed). Why would I want the computer to waste performance to spy on me? How is that a benefit to me as a customer? Oh right - customer's mean nothing to a monopoly.

Why would I want to spend money on an OS that runs SLOWER than XP? I will have to because they are only doing DirectX 10 for Vista (which John Carmack from ID says is ONLY to get people to buy Vista. There is no reason it couldn't be done in XP). Don't believe that almost anything runs worse in Vista than XP? See for yourself

http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/01/29/xp-vs-vista/index.html

And Vista has so-called tilt-bits (again to spy on you) that if anything strange occurs it decides that you are doing something dodgy and actively works against you. Yeah - right, in the IT world NOTHING every strange, or unpredicted happens.

I also heard that Casual game companies are quite upset at the development of Vista. Namely the hoops that they have to jump through to get their game to actually work on vista, increases their development costs significantly.

That is why I hate Vista. Its not so much that it is a new OS, and yeah - some of the arguments against Vista were also levelled at XP. However Vista marks a significant change in how MS views customers. Customers are no longer there to be serviced. Rather they are to be monitored as criminals and have to pay (in terms of money, hardware performance and stability) for the priviledge of this surveillance. But hey, its a new viewpoint right? Guess why they called it Vista?

Will most people run out and give MS billions of dollars to be treated this way? You had better believe it! I wish I was wrong - but Vista will be crammed down everyone's throats, and MS will profit from this new ideology.

Oh well ... what do I know?

Dano

I think the copy protection stuff will be cracked within a week or two.

Actually the crack beat the release

[url removed by moderator -- do not post links to crack/piracy instructions]

And yet another way:
http://apcmag.com/node/4769

But then, this isn't a surprise to anyone...

So how long before the first worm is written that triggers the license deactivation code that MS built into Vista licensing and turns millions of computers into large doorstops?

Gosh, wish I'd had time to follow and participate in this thread before things got so thick and fierce.

Put me down as Old-School MS-hater, Defender of Brad, and Vexed by Vista.

On the Vista business, I must confess that while many concerns voiced here are legitmate (not least things related to the economics of an unchecked monopoly), I know that I will eventually really value some stuff in Windows Vista.

That's despite how much I dread Vista's arrival in my work life and how many times it will annoy or outright harm me before SP2 is released. I don't believe MS innovates anywhere near as well as they think they do, but the sheer volume of new crap means that some gems will be hiding amongst the sputum. I like System Restore *a lot*.

Gosh, wish I'd had time to follow and participate in this thread before things got so thick and fierce.

Yes it has gotten ugly pretty fast, but who didn't see this coming. I don't want to be a flammer or a "Brad basher", but Brad: What were you thinking when you made this post!? When you have microsoft on the homepage of this website, your just asking for trouble! I know you are entitled to your opinion, and thats fine by me, but when you state your ideas...people...who disagree with you will openly conflict with your views and openly express their view simultaneously because they feel obligated to because you have shown your ideas openly. Kind of complicated I know but thats how I think the cookie crumbles.

FYI: I don't like the vista and I loathe Microsoft, but that doesn't mean anything against you.

Thanks for the Tom's Hardware link.

Yep, as you can see from their review, ALL graphics/video/sound developers should avoid Vista like the plague for the time being. Business users though could find things to love when they upgrade their office systems.

Currently it seems vista is a enthusiasts nightmare. Probably as intended too sadly. Microsoft wanted to make sure those pesky enthusiasts are kept under control.

Perhaps in a couple of years Vista will be evolved through service packs to be something people might actually want...guess we will have to wait and see.

Speaking of DX10 there is an article on Firing Squad with Tim Sweeney Mr.UT engine himself. According to him DX10 offers little to nothing in the visual department. It does allow programers to optimise a bit better and has some welcome "incremental" changes that will improve performance some.

He also said developers will be doing dx9 compatible games (at least they will) for the next 5 years most likely. Since alot of games use their tech it is unlikely that gamers will NEED to upgrade for at least several years. Most gamers will probably upgrade when they buy a new system.

So far I'm thinking Vista is in danger of becoming another Windows ME.

Since my business is Graphics I obviously will not be upgrading to Vista. Of course if Microsoft fixes peoples concerns and adds REAL open GL support and removes the drm crap then of course I'll reconsider.

I'll be getting vista, but I'm not doing it because I like vista. I'm doing it because DX10 is vista only, and I'm certainly leaving it for 6 months so it can "iron out the kinks"[/quote] Yep, this is the only reason for any gamer to get Vista. Speaking of DX10 there is an article on Firing Squad with Tim Sweeney Mr.UT engine himself. According to him DX10 offers little to nothing in the visual department. It does allow programers to optimise a bit better and has some welcome "incremental" changes that will improve performance some. End of quote I have no idea who this guy is but the general concencus in the gaming industry, from what Ive read and heard, is that dx 10 will be quite revolutionary. So dont listen to just one guy, listen to the majority (of game developers). He also said developers will be doing dx9 compatible games (at least they will) for the next 5 years most likely. Since alot of games use their tech it is unlikely that gamers will NEED to upgrade for at least several years. Most gamers will probably upgrade when they buy a new system. End of quote If you want the best gfx you need to, if you dont then you dont need to. I mean honestly have you even seen how for example Eve will look in dx 10? It's breathtakingly beautiful! [quote]Since my business is Graphics I obviously will not be upgrading to Vista. Of course if Microsoft fixes peoples concerns and adds REAL open GL support and removes the drm crap then of course I'll reconsider.

Im no expert but arent most professional games done with direct x already?

I think that most games are done with DirectX, and some are also programmed with OpenGL, but to create graphics, most of the really high end systems that are made specifically to create/render graphics use OpenGL cards.  You can use DirectX on those machines, but it's not as fast and the programs are more likely to crash.

I don't want a Media Center. I want to know what files I have on "my" PC and where they are without having to Google for them. I don't want cartoon character puppy dogs or paper clips to "help" me. I want a start menu that’s clear, concise and usable without having to hide a bunch of crap that I don’t want by using personalized menus. Yes, I do want to be shown hidden files and folders. No, do not hide extensions of known file types. No, do not hide protected operating system files from me (Yes, I *am* sure, you flaming a$$h0l3). No, I do not want software error reports downloaded to Microsoft. No, I do not want Windows to automatically check for every new POS update that Microsoft chooses to spit out. No, I do not have .NET Frameworks installed on my new PC. Yes, I specifically uninstalled it. No, I do not want to apply the 133 security updates to .NET Frameworks that Microsoft has deemed to be critical to my system performance. A PC is a “personal” computer. It should sit there like the lump of plastic, metal and silicon that it is, anxiously waiting for me to press a key and tell it to do something. It shouldn’t give me the hourglass because it’s busy doing something that I don’t even want it to be doing, all on the pretense of “helping” me. None of this stuff that supposedly helps me does any such thing. It helps everyone possible except me. That’s why I hate Microsoft.

Hear, bloody, hear!!!


SP2 for XP broke my system's access to my firewire card. I was on the phone with MS and they had me running some diag program. While it was running I was able to find the solution: register 1 (one) DLL! I did that and the problem was immediately solved. The MS tech had never heard of the solution and I even pointed him to where I found it.
My point is it sounds like actions like registering DLLs manually may not work in Vista. I need that level of control over MY system!

Why everybody swears and get so mad all of a sudden? What's wrong with you? Most of you never really tried the new OS, and are basing this on bigotry against the corporation (I'm a REBEL!), or twitched reviews. I never tried the OS, so I really have no opinion whatsoever. I'm sure it has alot of merits, and as of right now, alot of downfalls, like every other darn OS release in recent history.

You people have a really short memory.

Most of you, or your friends said the same darn things about XP when it was released: "it's an overhyped Win2000!, it's trying to control me and you and your mom too!, it's not working properly!, I prefer my Win98 - which works!, hey, it's just killed me dog, and made all the people in Africa starve!", but now everybody uses it and say it rocks. You guys are....I don't know. You just hate. It really proves us humans are really a bad race to deal with.

Stardock, this proves that the humans in GalCiv 2 really shouldn't be all that diplomatic, but instead, quite militaristic and hateful of everything they feel like.

Edit: oh, and Mumblefratz, go ahead and try to run GalCiv2, or almost any other game on anything other than an MS OS. Most of them don't work, right? Well, there are a couple of reasons why 90% of the computers in the world show that little window symbol when they're switched on. Most of the things you hate so much, can be turned off, but not all of the people in the world know how exactly to operate a PC and its innards. You and I are on the minority, here. That hourglass cannot be avoided, it was on MACs, it's on Linux machines, it's everywhere that you have a GUI-based OS. Again, you people just love to hate, but you take for granted everything that is working just fine.

And what's really dumb here is that you'll all have the exact same stupid and inflamed argument when a new OS will be released, this time, you'll stick to "Vista is working just fine, why do I need Windows (insert silly marketing name here)?"

Windows Vista has come out.  And I have to say, I really like it. Should you switch to it right away? No. I can't recommend it yet until the video driver situation is ironed out. But down the line there are a number of pretty nice things in it that I think people will want to take a close look at. Here's 5 reasons I think Windows Vista will appeal to gamers in the longer term or at least once the video driver situation is sorted out (if you're a gamer, WAIT a little bit until the video driver situation is good or you may find your favorite games don't run well): #1 Windows Vista comes with included, standardized performance benchmarking. So Vista literally gives your PC a score in all kinds of categories (CPU, Hard disk, video). As a result, imagine games in 2 years coming with their requirements listing what your performance ratings have to be instead of vague requirements we have today. We'll also have a standard way to know just how resource intensive a game is. My system rating is 4.0 for instance. #2 The Games Explorer. This is a thing that lets people easily manage all the games on their machine from a nice big friendly, Media-Center like console (though not nearly as nice yet but I think this is the direction they're taking). So a PC box with Vista could be mor eeasily used as a set-top box for gaming. #3 Parental Controls. Games that are Vista compliant include their ESRB rating. If parental controls is enabled, only games with the proper ESRB ratings can be played on the machine (and ones that don't comply get exluded entirely -- it will be interesting to see how this works out). #4 DirectX 10 #5 Better casual games. The 3D desktop has the advantage that you can do fancier things in little desktop type games. Plus, Vista comes with several casual games. While Windows Vista doesn't have much impact on what Stardock's developing (GalCiv II supports Windows 98), there are certainly a lot of nice features that we think will maek Windows Vista a better experience for gamers down the line.

Windows Vista is good? That is the most ridiculous statement I have heard!

The high price (for Windows Vista Ultimate especially. You really want to pay US$399 just for an OS??), draconian activation and "Software Protection Platform" are enough to make me avoid it for as long as possible. I won't pay Microsoft another cent of my money. Whatever advantages it may have is useless for me. I will still use Windows XP on my PC and my Macbook (Mac OS X of course).

Charge you for using your computer?? Where in blazes did you find out about that? Seriously, I don't know all the fuzz about Vista being bad, wrong and whatever you say. Most of the "bad things" (WGA, Validation, DRM, etc.) from "big brother" is their attempt to secure their stuff from being pirated. Their DRM schema is basically a "I don't trust people because people lie, cheat and lie" statement. If you pay for the stuff you will not have any trouble at all (I haven't got any problem with XP's WGA, Validations, etc.) Altough I find the protection schemas an annoyance at most I fail to see a problem at all except for the cracking/hacking community. If they manage to subvert the "product protection" schemas we will see a new brand of virus/spyware threat.

I guess you have not read some of the many problems encountered by people who have problems related to WGA (in Windows XP). And the problems are not because their Windows is pirated. At least some of them are related to WGA wrongly labelling legitimate Windows as pirated.

The possibility of Vista locking out the computer if it decides that it is pirated, however small, is unacceptable to me. As someone else have mentioned, Vista uses more CPU cycles to check and check whether it is pirated and to spy on users. Plain ridiculous and unacceptable.

You may have your reason to like Vista, but I certainly do not, and my opinion is shared by many others here.

I will never pay Microsoft another cent of my money. If any future games require DirectX 10 I will just not buy it (including games made by Stardock). I will avoid Vista now or in the future for as long as possible. I used to buy new versions of Windows soon after they are released, but not for Vista.

Stardock, this proves that the humans in GalCiv 2 really shouldn't be all that diplomatic, but instead, quite militaristic and hateful of everything they feel like.

Not that this got anything to do with Vista but humans are extremely violent by nature, its just that the average joe isnt aware of this since they werent around during the first and second war where millions after millions of people were slaughtered.

You dont even have to go so far back, just look at the iraq civil war. Estimated 700.000 causalties so far and its far from over.

It always amused me so when humans are almost always portrayed to be diplomatic and peaceloving in games/series when compared to other fictional races.