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Economic collapse during wartime - why?

Economic collapse during wartime - why?

Hi folks, I'm new to the game (just finished my fourth or fifth time through). I've noticed that my economy tends to go into a tailspin during wartime, usually crashing me to zero spending at exactly the worst time. Any suggestions on how to avoid this? I'm not entirely sure what the problem is. Some possibilities that have occured to me:
* maintenance on ships getting high as my fleet gets big
* loss of taxes as population gets put on invasion transports
* sudden added cost of colony maintenance when I conquer planets
* is there some kind of war weariness a la civ that could be dragging me down?

Thanks for any advice.
22,261 views 38 replies
Reply #26 Top

* maintenance on ships getting high as my fleet gets big


Bingo!!!!

Ship maintenance is the largest expense you during times of war. You need to develop a robust economy and a substantial warchest should you decide to go to war. I only played GalCiv 2 twice (currently on 2nd game) my advice is as follows:

1. Dump your imperial economy ASAP. Starting with a Republic you get a 10% bonus to your economy. A Democracy will give you +20%. The Federation will give you +30%.

2. Research technologies that allows you to build better factories and economic centers.

3. Populate as many PQ10 planets or higher. Never place more than one 2 farms on a planet for a population cap of 18 billion people. The next stop is 24 billion people with a 3rd farm you will need too many enterment structures to keep your approval above 70%.

EDIT: Build two of the most advanced farms you can research on non-bonus tiles will give you a max population cap of 20B people. Three will boost that to 27B, you don't want that many people.

4. If someone proposes that every race switch over to a Star Federation type government, vote yes.

5. While it may be good to have planets devoted to manufacturing or economics, I think it's best for most of your planets to be a combination of the two so that you can see how well each planet is doing in your Colony Screen View. Don't forget to throw in a Science lab or two either.

6. If the random event "Economic Boon" happens then take advantage of that to quickly build structures and save money as well. You can dramatically increase your treasury during this time.

7. If you can keep a minimal fleet of ships then do so. That way your fleet will not sap too much of your weekly income. I go down the "defenseless" route. I absolutely have no armed ship. The closest thing to any type of warship I have is the default flagship and a couple of unarmed scouts. It is the year 2230 (5th year) in my current game on the "challenging level" (above normal) and I still have no armed fleet whatsoever.

8. When designing your ships, be aware of the maintenance cost. That can quickly drain away your income. Even though economy is very robust and I have a huge warchest, I try keep the design of each planetary defensive ship to no more than 30 credits per week. I also try to design capital ships with no more than 100 credit maintenance. Note, I said design. I haven't built anything yet. Soon though, very soon.

9. Look at your empire expenses every now and then adjust your taxes accordingly to maintain income every week. Don't set it too high or your approval rating will drop. I currently have my hax rate at 43%.

10. Forgot to mention this before. Set the galaxy to huge. The more planets, the more income. But the game can take longer to finish. That's the way I like it.

11. Don't forget trade income either. If you trade with a race they are less likely to attack you.
I'm sure I'll pick up some more nuiances about the game as I play it more.
Reply #27 Top
I guess the biggest thing I've got from this thread - let me make sure I've got it correct. A planet producing nothing at the shipyard is producing extra income then, and may be able to pay for itself whereas one producing, say, capital ships that will take 120 turns, may not? So basically I shouldn't be building ships at ALL on the planets that are not production worlds?

This is vastly different than the way I've been playing, which was to make use of every available shipyard even during peacetime (constructors, etc) regardless of how long it took to produce a ship. Perhaps this is why I can't seem to break past 6000-8000 pts on my victories?
Reply #28 Top
I guess the biggest thing I've got from this thread - let me make sure I've got it correct. A planet producing nothing at the shipyard is producing extra income then, and may be able to pay for itself whereas one producing, say, capital ships that will take 120 turns, may not?


Pretty much. Unused production (on planets that are not building ships OR improvements) gets refunded, which can give you a false sense of economic security that is shattered once you go into wartime production mode.
Reply #29 Top
Don't underestimate the economic toll of conquering new planets. A planet full of factories with only 1 billion population is going to be spending (in maintenance and production costs) way more than it's making. I suppose you could stop building (social and military projects) on that planet if you've got enough production on your other worlds.
Reply #30 Top
Ideally, you should have way more than enough troops & transports to conquer the planet, and also seed it with a respectable population (~3 billion). War-time is usually not ideal, though. But if you can, you get to reuse the transports you used to ferry that extra population. When I play, if I'm in control of things, I spend a little extra time building a few extra transports, and also during that time research the soldiering techs. Neglecting the soldiering techs is a great way to wreck your war economy, too.

Another trick is you can espionage the planet's farms and morale structures and then info warfare it. When you take the planet, you get the agents back. Costs 800bc, though (unless you're evil and have the No Mercy Invasion Center, but that thing isn't worth it except on very large maps).
Reply #31 Top
When I play, if I'm in control of things, I spend a little extra time building a few extra transports, and also during that time research the soldiering techs. Neglecting the soldiering techs is a great way to wreck your war economy, too.


I'll do something along those lines. When circumstances permit I'll build transports, hide them away in a far corner or deep inside my sphere and let my production planets build back up their population before I go to war. This way I am taking the tax hit from the population drop in peactime while all my trade routes and such are in effect.

Something else to keep in mind is that any troops on the transport cross over when you upgrade as long as you upgrade to another transport ship (same for colony ships). So there is no reason to not build transports early and upgrade them later as you get better engines, life support etc.
Reply #32 Top
I've never upgraded a loaded transport before, but it sounds like an interesting idea if you've got vast swaths of space you're crossing. I've always just invaded with the old ones and built new ones to replace them.

What I have done before, though, is trade with the AI for his transports and he sold them to me loaded. SWEET!!!
Reply #33 Top
If your goal is to take away your enemy's capability to make war, then take along an empty troop transport or three. When you successfully invade one of his worlds that you don't really want, bring your soldiers back up and destroy the colony. That way, it doesn't add to your economy, and if you want it later on you can always colonise it yourself or invade the new occupier.

This is an especially good idea if you're going for the conquest victory and already have enough planets to do it.
Reply #34 Top
If your goal is to take away your enemy's capability to make war, then take along an empty troop transport or three. When you successfully invade one of his worlds that you don't really want, bring your soldiers back up and destroy the colony. That way, it doesn't add to your economy, and if you want it later on you can always colonise it yourself or invade the new occupier.


Are you secretly a spy for the Korath? Thou must die!! Evil evil! We must enslave the colonies, not kill them all!
Reply #35 Top
Mystikmind:

The source of your woes can be difficult to ascertain immediately. Look at the individual items on your economy screen to find out where your money is going. Net money going into the bank is not that important. You can always boost that by reducing spending. Gross money coming in is more important.

Even when you're netting 200 bc or less, you're probably earning a lot more - it's just that you have a lot more ships and planets to support now, so the money is going into production and maintenance rather than savings.

Having lots of Stock Markets won't help you if your planets have little to no population. Putting SMs on a slew of 6 pop industrial centers also won't make much of a diff.

Most planets have 2-4 industrial buildings. You sort of need that many or else your planet's not going to be building anything. When you start conquering, you will probably acquire a lot of such planets. Even when you burn spare pops and fill your new planets to the brim, the new influx of spending has to be factored in or you'll lose a lot of money.
Reply #36 Top
My idea is simple: wars shouldnt last much.

Dont get into wars easily. Sun Tsu said it 2500 years ago. Wars cost a lot, both to your economy and to your population. If it drags too much, you will lose as much as the enemy.

That means you have to win with as much strengh as you can, and quickly. Build a lot of strengh close to the borders, and when you think you´re ready, strike the enemy capital. Its all about the planets. Ships are useless. What you need is to take care of the planets, and make sure people dont invade yours too. You can win entire wars in less than 6 months.

If people atack you, let them come to you. They will be the ones who lose time and effort.
Reply #37 Top
You can win entire wars in one turn if you are well prepared enough. I know, lots of people think this is a cheap tactic, but I agree with NewForfeit. The key is to be at war for as short a time as possible. Also, I have said before and agree again, that all that matters in war is territory, not ships. Sadly, the AI always seems to look to see if its military rating is higher when it decides whether it wants peace, not noticing that it already lost half of its worlds to me...
Reply #38 Top
My experience has often been the opposite. I'll let wars drag on the entire game. This isn't Civ4; there is no war weariness. It's a little inconvenient to have to watch my back all the time, but hey--let him spin his wheels cranking out starships for me to turkey shoot. That's better than him pulling ahead in research. It would be nice if I could just invade all his planets and end it, but I have other priorities.