Extra Trade Routes???

There's a hard limit of 12 routes. You can't go over that whatever. Neutral shipping works, as far as I know, but it tends to take you over the limit if you have all the other techs already.

I would like to know if the limit of trade routes is moddable? Or is it hard coded into the game?

It, like so many things, is hardcoded.

Has anyone ever seen a dev explain *why* the limit is what it is? Am I missing some UI context where displaying over 12 would break thing? The list on the Econ screen is scrollable, the routes map seems able to tolerate an open # of lines, and the Diplo screen just shows yes-no, not how many trade routes.

I thought Stardock decided to make one of the primary design criteria for Galciv 2 to make it as modable as possible? If that was the case then wouldn't a design review have to have specifically authorised hardcoding something e.g. # trade routes?

Any stardock employees want to pull the meeting minutes and post the justification?

Was the AI code hidden for commercial reasons?

Echoing what has been said, the limit is 12.

I have no idea why, and it seems like a pretty unreasonable thing, considering all the ways to get "extra" routes.

I thought Stardock decided to make one of the primary design criteria for Galciv 2 to make it as modable as possible? If that was the case then wouldn't a design review have to have specifically authorised hardcoding something e.g. # trade routes?

The game is extremely moddable, given the limitation that the AI must be able to effectively use every permutation of settings that can be changed. 50 trade routes would be great (and more realistic), but the AI probably wouldn't understand the potential in that, and you'd just end up creaming them every time.

That said, I wish the game would let you change it anyway. Maybe when the AI becomes more configurable in DA, we'll be able to mess around more with things like this.

The aI would probably build mega amounts of trade ships if it could, ignoring war ships;...v 1.31 (not tried 1.4 yet) is pretty good - I only see a comparitive few Altarian traders wandering around aimlessly. I remember in 1.1 or 1.2 that there would literally be dozens of the light blue suckers ...like walking into a dirty kitchen and turning on the light to see all the bugs scuttling around. I can just imagine if it overbuilt for 50 routes instead of just the 12 there are now....

No, I think the AI would be a trading madman. Look at all the extra freighters that, for example, the Arceans and Alterians always have flying around aimlessly. If they could have more routes, they'd do it quickly.

Was the AI code hidden for commercial reasons?

I don't know about the other things, but the AI is all hard coded into the game. Even if we had the code, it really wouldn't help much, since we'd have to have to be able to recompile the game to do anything with it.

Though I bet in a few years if there a some really hardcore fans the game would be recompiled.

Thought it would definetly help things if they removed as much hard coded things as possible. Making a Modders job easier is always a plus for longevity.

Agreed Morberis, look what counterstrike did for Half-life's longevity.

My idea was not to have unlimited trade routes, but atleast have as many as the game allows for;
Regular Techs - 10
Neutral Techs - 3
UP Vote on TR - 4
Abilities +TR - 3

= Total of 20. If it is not possible, there really should not be possible to add more than 12 in the game, and therefore remove UP Vote, as well as one on Neutral Tech and one on Abilities +TR.

TIP

I really don't understand why there should not be at least one trade route from each planet.

I really don't understand why there should not be at least one trade route from each planet.

CPU usage?

The trade route limit of 12 reminds me of the population growth issue when the game first came out.

If you all remember, in 1.0 population growth was set so high that it was almost impossible not to get the max of 200 million per turn. So playing as the Torians or picking a population growth ability was a waste of ability points.

They fixed this by lowering the population growth rate substantially. Now you hear people saying that the 70% population growth ability is the only way to go.

So of course they could fix the trade-route limit by increasing the cap. As TIPederson indicated, it wouldn't have to be higher than 20. But they could also LOWER the amount of trade routes you get naturally (which is what TI suggests...) Of course, as CornhuskerMac wrote, some of the AIs (Arcean's come to mind for me) already build too many freighters as it is. Having them fly from planet to planet seems to be a bigger waste of CPU cycles than letting them settle into a route.

This is just a thought, but I wonder if the reason the Arcean AI (and others?) is building too many freighters is that it's "build freighter limit" is tied to the number of trade routes it's supposed to have based on its abilities and techs, not the 12-route limit. That would be interesting to check.

I understande the hardcaps but also agree that the max should be lifted on some of the and trade being one of them. But I also understand that trade doesnt neccasarily have to be at 20 considering the UP is a special event and even though it says permanantly doesnt mean it will be permanant as if it is brought up again it can change the settings on the new vote. So 16 would be good especially since some races atart with additional trade routes. and the UP increase would be so that other races can catch up.

I did not mean that it had to be 20. Just that I find it strange to be hardcoded to 12, when choices in the game allows for 20 routes.

And that the hardcode and max number of routes match up, so if hardcode is 12, then max is 12, or hopefully more.

TIP

You know, I never asked in the forum, but I always wondered why I should have more trade units do to game events, etc, and never got more. I did not know the hard cap was 12.