The art of getting updates...

Poll results

from GalCiv2 Forums

Our last poll asked people how they liked the update system we use with Galactic Civilizations II.  Our position on CD copy protection is pretty well known as this point -- we don't use it.

We just don't want people to have to keep a CD in the drive to use the game. Once it's installed on their home computers, players should not have to worry where any physical medium is.

On the other hand, to get the free updates, players do have to type in their serial #. This allows us to have much more expansive product updates because we can change all the files in the game if we want without significant fear that someone is going to combine it with a demo or even be able to play the game purely on the updates (if one looks at 1.0 to 1.3, nearly every major game file has been changed).

The serial # then talks to our server which knows which serial #s have been issued and creates an account for the user. The user can then not only download updates but re-download the entire game. So even if you lose your serial # AND the CD years from now, you can still come on and re-download the entire game with the account it created (when you use Stardock Central, your Stardock.net account knows all the products you've purchased so you don't have to type in serial #s again).

In the poll, 83% of users like the system. 17% of users did not.  Some users don't like having to type in a serial #. Others don't like having to use the Internet to register the product to get updates. That's understandable, there's trade-offs with any system. 

The next poll is a follow-up to the previous multiplayer poll.  Stardock does, however, plan to create an expansion pack sometime mid next year to GalCiv II that includes multiplayer depending on how well Dark Avatar sells (pricing would be about the same as Dark Avatar and it would have lots of other features as well to make sure it appeals to a wide spectrum).

23,442 views 31 replies
Reply #1 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
blummin slow yur server, just downloading the game now, I got a 10meg connection it started off at about 200k a sec, now its less than 100.

scuse me while i go slash my wrists. or cancel the download, and use my discs.

or oh well, started so i'll finish.


Reply #2 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

(moderator: not a Dark Avatar discussion, comment moved here)

Ashes of the Singularity II
Reply #3 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Well ideally everything would be free and we won't need copyright protection but things aren't ideal so given that I think you have the best content delivery/copyright protection system, at least that I encountered. Maybe it's more cumbersome if you don't have stardock central but I do and... can I just say how freaking nice it is not to have to go through twenty dialogs and 5 restarts just to install or update a piece of software! Applications like stardock central are the future of content delivery though if Microsoft has its way, it's a future far away, not the "not too distant"

Now that my fanboy drooling is done let me put in my 2 cents about multiplayer in turn based strategy games. Never got into that really, don't know why, maybe it's the pace maybe I just had bad luck with the games I tried. Although to be honest there's also the matter of my ego - it's one thing having your head blown off by some pimply 13-year old in Counter-Strike, in 30 seconds I get a chance to do that to him. However, watching that 13-year old slowly and methodically decimate my economy, enslave my people and take over the galaxy - not my idea of fun. I get enough of that from the AI thank you very much.

Having said that, if you are going to do multiplayer then you might as well do it well. Who knows, I might just change my mind about it.
Reply #4 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
S1Genocide, I don't care for much of the stuff that you want to have in an expansion and am really excited about the expansion that we are going to get.
Opinons, eh

And they are adding two races. The race/races that die will ONLY die in the campaign. They will still be available in sandbox games, meaning that you will be able to choose from 12 different races + custom.
Reply #5 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I'd really like a hotseat option... I don't care too much about the internet multiplayer. So I don't really know what to say on the poll...
Reply #6 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Stardock does, however, plan to create an expansion pack sometime mid next year to GalCiv II that includes multiplayer depending on how well Dark Avatar sells (pricing would be about the same as Dark Avatar and it would have lots of other features as well to make sure it appeals to a wide spectrum).


If u want me to buy a multiplayer expansion pack, then those features r going to after be out of this world.

What happened to a multiplayer expansion taking 3/5's - 4/5's of the development time/resources?

I have played multiplayer in lots of different games, its very, very frustrating with players dropping out, changing email addresses, real life intruding etc, etc. Just a waste of time playing in such games. Even hotseat, I have had so many of those games saved and never revisited.

U will just end up with a small hardcore, vocal group playing multiplayer.
Reply #7 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

What happened to a multiplayer expansion taking 3/5's - 4/5's of the development time/resources?

By next year, we can borrow multiplayer code from Society which reduces the cost.

Reply #8 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I just wanted to comment on the current registration/update scheme. Personally, I find this update scheme to be a perfect balance of copy protection and usability. I don't quite understand why people don't like registering a product they purchased in order to get free, and, in the case of Stardock, fantastic and frequent updates. It's not like the registration process is difficult; we aren't in the days of paper registrations, so I don't see the problem.

Personally, I love the fact that I don't need a CD, which I don't have anyways since I bought online. Furthermore, I enjoy that my registration entitles me to the excellent updates that Stardock releases.

A bad "authorization" scheme is the version of Steam that was available when HL2 was released. I was preloaded and ready to go on release day, I managed to play for 2 hours before taking a break and when I came back and tried to logon, I couldn't. The authentication servers were overloaded so my copy couldn't be "authorized" and therefore wouldn't even load. I had to wait until the following day to play a game that I had purchased. A system like that is definitely unacceptable.

As for Dark Avatar, I will definitely purchase it thanks to Stardock's excellent products, policies/practices, and overall fantastic after-sale support.

Just my two-cents.
Reply #9 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I would hope that there would be a version of the proposed expansion avail via d/l that does not include the multiplayer option for those of us who do not want this feature. I would also hope that this version would be available at a reduced cost! Personally i don't see why i should have to pay out money for a feature i would never use, esp seen as the majority of game purchasers (last X polls) do not want this feature. That said i will always be happy to part with my money for any update that adds to this great game, just not MP.

DG
Reply #10 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I for one am looking forward to a multiplayer option. Not PBEM though. Stardock can tally my purchase right now.
Reply #11 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I'm looking forward to a multiplayer expansion too and will buy it. I wonder how many people might be attracted by GalCiv that aren't now once it has multiplayer. I think it's not a negligible number - and having no account here, they didn't participate in the polls.
Reply #12 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I will also be looking forward to multiplayer. Not necessarily playing against unknown people over the 'net but over a LAN or network with family / friends.

Tally my purchase too.
Reply #13 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Anyway, back on topic, I think the system is a good one. When it works it works well, and when it doesn't its only mildly annoying. I get much more frustrated having to search for CD's, and with some games (like Starcraft for example) my CD's end up scratched to death. I only hope I don't forget my username like I've done on other forums. Not many sites have good username recovery.
Reply #14 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I'm happy with a copy protection system that doesn't punish me for buying the game. Stardock's system suits me quite well. In fact I'm surprised that they don't rent it out to small games developers looking for a good delivery system.
Reply #15 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I would hope that there would be a version of the proposed expansion avail via d/l that does not include the multiplayer option for those of us who do not want this feature.


I agree. Being married with two young children I need the flexibility that is only possible in a single player game. As such I will only purchase expansions that enhance the single player experience. Thank you Stardock for not forgetting players that can't play multiplayer.

I have read it is possible to get the AI to just play against the other AI players but I have not been able to get this to work in v1.2. Is this possible in v1.3? It would be cool to watch the AI players play against each other to see how each does. Kind of like watching a movie; probably more entertaining than most TV!

Just out of curiosity, how will the multiplayer be implemented. I hope when this expansion comes out, the players complaining about no multiplayer purchase it but I fear they might have moved on to other games.
Reply #16 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
The registration/copy protection scheme is fine. Much nicer than having to download "cracks" so that we don't need the CD in other games. I virtually refuse to play any game that requires a CD! The only improvement I'd say is put in the dashes to break up the serial number so it's easier to read and type!

I'll toss in another vote for multiplayer. Multiplayer is an essential feature. Forget the strangers on the web (I hate those idiotic services to connect you with other players), we have plenty of friends that we can play with that we know and trust to be patient and not disconnect.

Preferred forms of Multiplayer:
1) Live connect (actually best would be to let us host a server that players can connect to any time they wish to get the latest turn and submit their latest turn).
2) Play by e-mail - for turn based games this provides a nice reliable way to have a long game where nobody is waiting for someone else.

Concerned about waiting for the other players to make their turns? Well the best solution is to allow you to do other tasks (design ships) while waiting. Otherwise it's not hard to just pick up a book and read when you are waiting for the other person (please include an audible next turn notification sound!).

Hotseat? Are you kidding? No thank you.

Oh, and where are the polls?
Reply #17 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

In fact I'm surprised that they don't rent it out to small games developers looking for a good delivery system.

And what is Totalgaming.net?

Reply #18 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
As anyone who has read any of my posts knows, I do love this game. However I should make a point that was relayed to me this morning from some in house IT people with regards to this game. They all seemed to agree that the game's issues sound more like inexperienced developers/programmers than hardware configs. That said I really couldn't argue since they pointed out that every other game that I have purchased and played has run without incedent, no matter what machine I had at the time. They said that if I noticed, actual gaming co.'s made the games. So there I stand, with spacedust in my mouth, unable to defend what has become one of my fav games. In the end, it seems that they may be right. Still, I don't care. I will always try to play this game, even if it never lets me finish one, which may happen since I haven't been able to finish one yet.
Reply #19 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I like the Stardock system for updates. I like even better that it allows you to get all the revenue straight to your business rather than going through a middleman.
Reply #20 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I think the makers always forget that the people who bought this game in the first place aren't gonna answer "we won't buy it unless it has mplayer" since those players won't be registred on this site. You have players wich bought it because, or even though, it didn't have mplay. The others are out there! And it's a very big market.

Personally I was very confused after I bought this game and saw it didn't have hotseat to play with my friends wich is the kind of games we always play. I'm no programmer but hotseat shouldn't be that hard, right?

Anywayz, the choices on the poll don't let you decide much. Either you don't mind it not having mplay (3different choices to tell the same thing!!) or they won't have bought this game because of it and are not bound to be participating on the poll. Make real choices please. Something like: 1. I don't want mplay, this game rocks 2. I'd like it but I'm cool with the game the way it is 'cuz it rocks 3. I bought it because I thought it had mplay or at least suspected it would get it soon and I'm heavily dissapointed and really want it, the game still rocks though 4. I won't ever buy a game without mplay

Maybe you also need a poll to see what kind of mplay people want. There's no need for you to build an entire time-consuming and costly expantion if people simply want hotseat or play by email instead of real-time multiplayer.

I just feel like you guys make the polls in a way that you already know the outcome, it's manipulated up front.
Reply #21 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Personally I am not even slightly interested in multiplayer. But if that expansion has a decent amount of stuff that will interest the single player I will happily buy it. I don't ask for a ton, maybe make the expansion 25% stuff that the single player can use as well.
Reply #22 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
However I should make a point that was relayed to me this morning from some in house IT people with regards to this game. They all seemed to agree that the game's issues sound more like inexperienced developers/programmers than hardware configs. That said I really couldn't argue since they pointed out that every other game that I have purchased and played has run without incedent, no matter what machine I had at the time. They said that if I noticed, actual gaming co.'s made the games. So there I stand, with spacedust in my mouth, unable to defend what has become one of my fav games


Um, Civilization 4 didn't work on most ATI cards when it shipped. Is Firaxis inexperienced too? Go check out the Oblivion forums, are they inexperienced?

You're always going to have a % of people who have some problem with a game. If you check out the GalCiv 2 forums there really aren't that many people having problems, even when the game was first release.
Reply #23 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I am indifferent to multi-player in an expansion, as, like many gamers, I have a family, 2 jobs, etc. The real attraction of a game like GC is the single player component wherin I can build an empire and execute my master plan late at night while everyone else is sleeping. I will purchase expansions though, simply for the single player content. One thing that concerns me about the serial number system is that I like to have multiple copies of a game downloaded onto my computer for mod purposes ( 1 version modded, the other original). This hasn't been neccesary with GC because the MOD folder allows most mods to be in place without changing the game. Still, that would be my main concern with the serial # system for game registration and updates.
Reply #24 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Please please please add multiplayer!
Single player is nice but I miss MP! I still play Master of Orion 2 because it has an MP mode.
Reply #25 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
it would have lots of other features as well to make sure it appeals to a wide spectrum).


All that means is that the players who don't want it, still have to buy it if they want the other features.

Please release a non-MP version of the next pack at the same time.

K Thx