Why choose another race?

The other races do have different starting abilities, and at least some of them are considerably better than the Human's abilities (particularly Drath and Yor). The other races also tend to begin with more technologies than the Humans do.

Eh? The human race is nowhere near the best. That title has famously lied with either the Drath or the Yor. Probably going to swing back to Yor now, with the miniturisation changes.

However, in the end it depends on your playstyle. If you play a diplomat, then you're going to be good with humans. If your thing is crushing the galaxy, then the Drengin or Yor are for you. The Economists among us have a tendancy to meld with the Korx. And since I'm a sneaky, subversive, evil sod, I play the Drath and just keep the galaxy in a firm state of chaos.

And dialogue. The non-human dialogue is funnier

I see that each have their own bonuses and such

You said it right there!

I've had great success playing the Thalans.

Is there a balance though, somewhere? (new too btw)

Couple questions:
1. If you select some of the civs and go to reset abilities, certain civs have innate bonuses like the human +25 diplomacy. Some civs don't have any innate bonuses though, and the custom civ seems to get an innate bonus of soldiering and loyalty for some reason. Are the no-innate civs balanced out with more starting techs or something else?

2. If I select humans, then diplomacy and click on any of the other bonuses, the innate 25 bonus goes away. I don't seem to get any sort of refund for it and there doesn't seem to be any way to get that 25 bonus back unless I go back and reselect civs. Is this normal?

I've never not played as a custom race.

always played as a custom race, since I didn't find a fast starter in the mix.

Though, I noticed that the custom races tend to have less that the rest. and preseeing 'reset' to start picks again may delete any basic boni (like soldiering/loyalty), or maybe there's an extra bug in that area, not sure

For all races the starting abilites consist of "inherent abilites" plus pre-selected abilites from the 10 points that you have to assign. When you press reset you clear the pre-selected abilities but the "inherent abilities" remain. This gives you the 10 points back for you to allocate as you choose. However, if you try to change or add points to "inherent abilities" you actually lose the inherent ability.

For example, humans start out with an inherent 25% diplomacy ability. If you hit reset the 25% diplomacy ability remains. If try to add an "extra" 10% diplomacy for the stated 2 points what results is you've spent 2 points and your total diplomacy ability will be 10%. You want to select a race whose inherent abilities you don't want to modify, use reset to get back the 10 points, then allocate the 10 points on the abilities you do want to modify.

You can tell what the "inherent abilities" are by looking at the data under the abilities tab. If the race has a bonus but none of the options are checked then it's an "inherent ability". Also note that all of the "inherent abilities" have a value that's not selectable in the menu. For example, the Altarians have a 30% Creativity ability but only 25% is selectable in the menu.

You also should consider your political party choice in conjuntion with racial abilities. You may want to use the party choice to get a bonus in an area that you don't get from abilities. However, you could also use the party to amplify a bonus chosen from race.

I personally think economics is the key and so would chose anyone except the Korx (so far mostly gone with the Drath). I want the top 30% Economics bonus and use the points to get it. The Korx's 15% "inherent bonus" isn't sufficient. I also select Federalist to get another 20% economic bonus for a total of 50%. The Drath do seem to get the best total set of bonuses though I think the single best "inherent bonus" is the 25% morale bonus that both the Drengin and Torian get (morale = money).

Besides the abilities, another race selection criteria is starting techs. With the humans you start out with some techs and get a few points to allocate to other techs. With all the other races the starting techs are defined and can't be modified, but in general are much better than what the humans can manage. Starting with Ion drive is a big advantage, it allows an immediate 4 parsec/wk colony ship, or you can immediately research Impulse drive for even faster ships.

The beauty of this game is the wide variety of potentially successful strategies. You need to study the options of race, ability, starting techs and political party and make your choices based on your overall strategy. There is no one right answer.

Good answer, Mublefratz... but...

I guess the question still stands though, ARE the races balanced out somehow that I can't see?

Every race gets 10 points, it seems that the races with inherent stats are just plain *better* than the races without... the starting techs seem to be about the same for the nonhumans generally, so I don't see non-inherent-stat races getting a bigger tech advantage or anything first.

Am I missing something?

IMHO the races are definitely not balanced.

Am I missing something?

Yes.

There are "free" bonuses for every race and they vary. When you reset the bonuses from the setup menu, you'll see them remaining. BTW, don't clear those or you're giving yourself a handicap. They're free and supposed to be there. These are, in part, what sets the races apart. Other factors are home planet PQ and starting techs. For example, the Drath have the most free bonuses. The Thalans have the highest home planet PQ. The Yor have a hefty miniturization bonus. The balance seems pretty good really except for the Humans who have the least free bonuses, least starting techs, and a PQ 10 home planet. Pick your race depending on your play style as mentioned previously in this thread. Where you put your 10 bonus points is important. Only Custom Race can set starting techs which can be an advantage. Don't play Human unless you want the handicap or just want to be Human.

I guess the question still stands though, ARE the races balanced out somehow that I can't see?

Nope. the races are what they are, and just like in real life not all species are created equal (let's see a giraffe research computers...).

OMG!!! they're not balanced???? We better nerf them all NOW!!!

I want all races to be the same and NOT have different abilities....


WAAAAAA! WAAAAAA!!!

If all the races where the same, the only way to have fun would be a costom race.

Well, balanced != the same.

Having one race thats say, better at ground invasions but worse at ship defense can be balanced with a race thats better at research but worse at manufacturing... but to have one race thats average, and other races that are significantly above average seems like an odd choice.

Whatever, its all good. Every race seems to have the ability to make time vanish though ... I don't think I've gone to bed before 2am in a week

Racial bonuses are probably one of the least polished parts of the game, I've noticed. The way some racial bonuses take up points while other don't, and the way putting points into the same thing as you have a racial bonus for will overright the racial bonus instead of adding to it, and the way (and this applies to racial starting technologies too) every race has a vastly different number of racial traits each.

The best thing to do would be to fix the overwrite bug, make all the bonuses fixed (unchangable) but don't take up points and balance it out numerically (for instance, maybe each race gets three +20% bonuses to three stats and five start technologies each).

The races would all be different and geared towards different play styles, but it would be a lot more polished.

But meh. Doesn't really matter...but it's still a little annoying.

Since this game was made specifically for single player then the races don't have to balanced in anyway. I really like the fact that some races are inherently stronger than others. Only multiplayer would need for balance between the races.

Since this game was made specifically for single player then the races don't have to balanced in anyway. I really like the fact that some races are inherently stronger than others. Only multiplayer would need for balance between the races.

Why would Multi player change that fact unles you are talking more then 2 players then I understand. There are enough 'good' races for just 2 players to pick from.

I like playing custom race so I can build the race more in line with my play style. I am fairly new at this game so I am still in the tweaking process but getting close.
Personally I like how they are not 'balanced' and I like to set the races I play against to random, that way I never know what I am getting into

Why would Multi player change that fact unles you are talking more then 2 players then I understand. There are enough 'good' races for just 2 players to pick from. I like playing custom race so I can build the race more in line with my play style. I am fairly new at this game so I am still in the tweaking process but getting close. Personally I like how they are not 'balanced' and I like to set the races I play against to random, that way I never know what I am getting into

Even if it were just 2 players, they should be able to choose any race and know that they are on equal footing. I know that I wouldn't want to be limited to certain 'good' races if I wanted to compete against another player.

Yea, the whole free bonus thing is confusing. The first time most people see it (including me), it looks like a bug. You think, "What are these bonuses that have no check mark in the points section?" Your first instinct is to check and uncheck some points which does reset it (and shouldn't). It takes a while to realize, "Oh, those are *supposed* to be there." Some text in that box indicating when a bonus is free would eliminate a few forum posts.

Here's a question regarding custom races. I much prefer making my own custom races to play with - much more personal I find. The one thing that erks me is that everytime I start a new game with my custom race, my system is always made up of one pq-10 planet and one pq-4 planet. Is this a default setting? And if so, is there any way to change it from within the game menus?
Thanks in advance.

my system is always made up of one pq-10 planet and one pq-4 planet. Is this a default setting? And if so, is there any way to change it from within the game menus?

Not in game, no. You can edit CustomPlanets.xml if you want to change those (you just can't play on the metaverse with that change).

Why would Multi player change that fact unles you are talking more then 2 players then I understand. There are enough 'good' races for just 2 players to pick from.

Because in EVERY MP game out there, if one race or player type has an advantage all the lil' kiddies would (and do) mostly use THAT one.

Then you get the nerf-ninnies crying, "nerf the goddamn Yor already. Everybody is only using them!"

One of the reasons I hate/love MP.

Drath > Yor. Fat lot of good that miniturisation bonus is if I know every last detail of their empire within 3 months of game start, and the defence bonus is enough to offset the miniturisation when you get to big ships.

Also, as a good race I can happily set the rest of the galaxy on the Yor, then use the espionage knowledge and a small fleet to capture key worlds.

The problem Skyjack is that happens in EVERY multiplayer game NO matter how balanced the classes are, maybe that is one reason they have not been in a hurry to add multi player they don't want to have to deal with that problem.