Some General Game Comments

from GalCiv2 Forums
Just wanted to drop some general Comments about GalCiv II, maybe someone in charge reads things here once in a while.


Overall I like the game, theres been a real shortage of 4x Space games last 10 years and even MOO1 and 2 have been getting pretty dull of late. Lots of depth, difficulty is not based on 7 alien races all launching themselves at you at the same time. I got espeically tired of MOO2's habit of your closest allies for NO reason declareing war and 1 second later your high value system is being attacked by 250 ships. Theres none of that and thats good-thanks.

Couple of things I find curious(not the only things) but just a couple that stand out in my mind.

-The Map system. I have mixed feelings about the way the galaxy is layed out. Its not....all bad and I am getting used to it, but atm in not overly sold on the wide-open format. IMO its a little hard on fleet management and imo its really quite easy to lose track of ships esp on the huge maps. The map does not even show for example-planets that have ships docked-which muddles things even further. In short I find ship and fleet management(the UI) that is, leave a little to be desired.

The map sort of ties in to another thing I noticed almost right away.

Starbases. The economic bases are a great idea both conceptually and practically. I like . Military starbases otoh, Dont seem....very practicall for several reasons. One, its takes a huge investment of time and resouces to build them up-even one semi decent milbase is a lot of work. Secondly, and this is more important. Due to the 'wide-open' nature of the map, when at war, the enemy simply bypasses them and they dont really serve as either a front line of defence or a last one for that matter. Since they dont really serve as planetary defenders if your (world) is under attack and theres a milbase right next door, the enemy can simply ignore the base and conquer and the world anyhow. Also, milbases DO have a radius of effect yes, but they dont serve to slow down(or engage\hinder enemy fleets in transit either) an enemy when they can simply steer around them and head wherever they want. This seems counter-intuitive. A space-faring empire would not build expensive static defensive bases if there presumed enemies can simply ignore them at will. This is more or less what I see happening with milbases. They should exert SOME sort of zone of control that actually makes them a impediment to an enemy. Also worlds that are directly protected by a Milbase(say within 3 hexes? cant be landed on while the base is active.-seems to make sense. Nor does it seem reasonable that we cant capture enemy starbases.

Influence Bases, again a neat concept, make the(enemy?-or allied worlds) want to join you. A way to win a bloodless victory. Good idea, tho I must confess I find it ...a little easy to win over worlds this way. Overall I like these bases but maybe(?) its a little to easy to win useing them. All it seems to take is 2 bases beaming feelgood propaganda and 'Wheel of fortune re-runs' into a system you think would be better off under your control and its yours

Bases and AI lack of territorial enforcement. Also related to all these bases is another thing that to me, stands out. The AI does not recognize territories controlled by others very well. This works both ways too. Some games has the AI placeing incredibly weak (ie useless) Milbases in MY systems. From a realism PoV anyone would consider such an act even from an ally to be either downright suspicous or an act of war in any other case. However in galciv I have placed Milbases and influence bases right in my neighbors home system with no ill-effects. IOW as long as your on more or less good terms diplomatically speaking(that is-not actually at war), the AI lets you get away with actions that I would consider an act of overt or covert warfare. I have yet to suffer any ill-effects from such actions. There is no way I can think of to either prevent an AI from placeing bases wherever they feel like or players for that matter, nor can you force them to leave once there placed, by diplmotic means. Sames goes for ships as well. There is no for example, 'Your warships have violated my space-remove at once' option. Now in cases where territory is contested then influence could have a major impact in determineing where and how you can move. In areas that are firmly under your control and influence-it hardly seems sensible that warships of other powers roam around at will-placeing installations and so on.


All in all a good game, has to lots to recommend it
7,282 views 11 replies
Reply #1 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Military starbases otoh, Dont seem....very practicall for several reasons. One, its takes a huge investment of time and resouces to build them up-even one semi decent milbase is a lot of work. Secondly, and this is more important. Due to the 'wide-open' nature of the map, when at war, the enemy simply bypasses them and they dont really serve as either a front line of defence or a last one for that matter. Since they dont really serve as planetary defenders if your (world) is under attack and theres a milbase right next door, the enemy can simply ignore the base and conquer and the world anyhow. Also, milbases DO have a radius of effect yes, but they dont serve to slow down(or engage\hinder enemy fleets in transit either) an enemy when they can simply steer around them and head wherever they want. This seems counter-intuitive. A space-faring empire would not build expensive static defensive bases if there presumed enemies can simply ignore them at will. This is more or less what I see happening with milbases. They should exert SOME sort of zone of control that actually makes them a impediment to an enemy. Also worlds that are directly protected by a Milbase(say within 3 hexes? cant be landed on while the base is active.-seems to make sense. Nor does it seem reasonable that we cant capture enemy starbases.


Military starbases aren't supposed to be a fortress or supposed to hinder your enemy, they are just support for ships by giving extra attack and defense to their stats when they're within range of the starbase, and it doesn't take that many modules to make a fleet of weak fighters a destructive powerhouse. So your point is mute there, but I agree with you about the territory managment. And i've never had a problem with fleet managment, although sometimes I find problems.
Reply #2 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
The Map system. I have mixed feelings about the way the galaxy is layed out. Its not....all bad and I am getting used to it, but atm in not overly sold on the wide-open format. IMO its a little hard on fleet management and imo its really quite easy to lose track of ships esp on the huge maps. The map does not even show for example-planets that have ships docked-which muddles things even further.


The GalCiv series has always had "free-range" movement. The only part that is new in GC2 is having planets on the main map.

Planets that have ships in orbit have a shield icon on them.

Military starbases... the enemy can simply ignore the base and conquer and the world anyhow.


You misunderstand how Military starbases work. Military starbases are not intended to nor to they actually exert any control or power of their own. Their power lies in the 'ship assist' modules, which makes any friendly ships in their radius more powerful (especially very small ships, which are weaker to begin with); a planet *must* have ships in orbit in order to prevent invasions, and military starbases can make even the weakest defender put up a good fight. Otherwise, a military starbase acts just like any other--it sits there and only fights back when it is directly attacked.

Influence Bases, again a neat concept, make the(enemy?-or allied worlds) want to join you. A way to win a bloodless victory. Good idea, tho I must confess I find it ...a little easy to win over worlds this way. Overall I like these bases but maybe(?) its a little to easy to win useing them. All it seems to take is 2 bases beaming feelgood propaganda and 'Wheel of fortune re-runs' into a system you think would be better off under your control and its yours


What difficulty are you playing on? Normally it takes quite a bit of influence before a planet will 'flip' (they will begin to consider flipping when you have 4x the influence of the owner, but it's a very small chance). And the AI does not generally take kindly to influence 'invasions'.

Now in cases where territory is contested then influence could have a major impact in determineing where and how you can move. In areas that are firmly under your control and influence-it hardly seems sensible that warships of other powers roam around at will-placeing installations and so on.


Influence is not a border. It is just that, influence. The 'borders' shown on the map are only for your benefit, delimiting which areas are most strongly influenced by which race. The only real borders are the atmospheres of your planets.

Again though, the AI's reaction depends on what difficulty you're playing at. Normally they will take offense at any military or influence bases built near their planets, and will complain or declare war if you station ships near them (esepscially transports).
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Reply #3 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
No one controls outer space so there is no "territory" other than the immediate orbits of your planets.

Military bases are very helpful to an invading fleet. I've used them to quite good effect.

If you can't find a ship, there is a menu popup that shows all the ships you control. Click on the picture and it will take you to the ship.

I agree that influence bases seem like a hostile act, but the AI might not see it that way. After all, what you're doing is broadcasting "I Love Lucy" re-runs to the nearby planets. What's the harm in that? In real life, only the most tyrannical regimes see foreign entertainment broadcasts as a threat to their existence.

Reply #4 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Its pretty obvious Kyro your quite new to both rational thought and the 4x Genre, so ill take a few moments out of my day to help you out.

If there is anyone that does not understand how bases work, take a long look in a mirror. No 4x game has ever made static bases or planetary defences truly effective, or even moderatley effective. Galciv is no exception-got that? Weither you like it not, Milbases are not particularly effective, nor do they act in a manner consistent with what one would expect of a civilization expending resources to make such structures. The comments I make are of a conceptual nature, not how things 'are' right now. I can see conceptulization is not a skill you possess to any great degree. Honestly, I dont really care about internal though processes, or lack there-off.

Infulence isnt a border? WOW REALLY? Thanks for the info. Once again you astounding ability to comprehend basic concepts and even english is nothing short of....well...nothing. I cant be bothered to explain the concept of borders, and territory for you. Please look them up in a dictionary. As for the concept of influence goes, thats an abstraction in Galciv as well as the real world. If you want a grown-up real world example, countries have 'influence' over others, some greater than others..some less. And it manifests itself in differrent ways in varying degrees as well. Yet the concept of 'territorial integrity' is something is something totally different from 'influence' such as this game defines it. And yes I think the idea should have been in-corporated into the game in some manner, if you dont like that thought expressed(of which you were not the intended recipient of in any event) ..too bad.

Thanks for playing kid.....
Reply #5 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Insulting Stardock employees (least of all the forum's head moderator) certainly doesn't help your argument.

You made some uninformed complaints about various gameplay mechanics. I provided you information on how they function in the game, as it was certainly obvious from your post that you did not fully grasp them on your own.

If you still can't grasp them or the point of my post, and it's apparent you don't, there's nothing I can do for you. And there's certainly nothing you can to to 'help me out'.

If you think things should be changed, then you might want to be a little more pleasant with the people who would be responsible for making those changes.
Reply #6 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Dear John,

The replies to your original post were designed to be helpful, not abusive. Many posters (apparently not yourself) have had difficulties understanding how these particular game concepts work, and so Reply #2 was a (rather kind) effort to ensure that you do understand these concepts.

Yet you have returned this kindness with insults. For shame.

Personally, I would have responded to your reply (#4) in some detail, but do not intend to be abused by you in turn. I'll just leave it with this: based on my reading of your posts, I do believe that you have a misconception/hangup on conceptually how influence/territory and starbases might play out IRL if Earth is ever fortunate enough (and physics amenable enough) to obtain interstellar FTL spacecraft. And I think GC2 is a pretty good stab at it.
Reply #7 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
"Just wanted to drop some general Comments about GalCiv II, maybe someone in charge reads things here once in a while."

"if you dont like that thought expressed(of which you were not the intended recipient of in any event) ..too bad."

Hey man, just 'cause you got what you wanted....no reason to try bite his head off. Kryo, I would think, has a grasp on the concepts of this game. He works for the company that made the damn game. And he brings up a good point. WHat difficulty are you playing on? I am sitting on challenging and it takes me 3 planets and 2 maxed out influence bases to flip 1 planet, and 2 turns later they declared war on me.

Up the difficulty. You'll see how the starbases actually are intended, and do, work. Until then, wise man say 'Don't try to flame Mods.' Especially when you fail miserably at that.
Reply #8 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I like the way the influence bases work. In fact, "flipping" planets is a really fun part of the game. I don't find it all that easy. For me, I have to install all the influence increasing modules (11 in all) to really get a good probability. On top of that, I need a fairly effective overall influence level. I've had planets that wouldn't flip and have had to delete the base due to its impact on relations. They notice them and will get hostile if you try to initiate an all-out influence attack. They will declare war on you. There's a certain amount of inlfuence that can be exerted and "gotten away with". I don't think influence is overly effective and I don't see a problem with any aspect there. OTOH, if you have a huge overall influence advantage over the AI, planets will flip when in your area of influence without any starbases. That's very hard to do on a gigantic map at Masochistic or above so it's like a reward. Fine by me.

Military starbases I'm not so hot on. They do seem to take a lot of work for a marginal impact in war faring capability. Their game mechanics, effective or not, are their mechanics. Would like to see them do more than just increase your hitpoints in their area of effectiveness. But, you don't *have* to build them, so I don't.

The AI does seem to be a little forgiving at times, but not always. I can place attack ships in their space without them getting hostile. OTOH, troop carriers will piss them off in no time. In any case, it's not like they're oblivious to what I'm doing.

I don't have a lot of problems with the mini-map. For the most part, it works great for me and is an invaluable supplement to the tactical view. I *would* like to be able to offer it more screen real estate. I'd also like to have a control to turn on and off galactic resources. On a gigantic map, they don't show up at %100 zoom. On higher zoom levels, you can't shut them off. One other glitch is that you can hit the turn button when mousing down to the bottom of the map. That one has got me at a few bad times.

Some of your points I understand and agree with. However, some of it is just personal preference. In any case, we should be able to discuss what we like and don't like about the game without about getting into a flame war.

Reply #9 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
John,

Many come here for questions about the game or to make general statements about their game play experiences, even make posts regarding their personal opinions. Most people enjoy sharing knowledge here, what you take away from what is posted is only for you to decide. Just because someone says such and such, obviously doesn't make it so. When someone posts a reply to try and help, or answer questions, especially if that someone is an employee of Stardock, try and be a little more grateful someone actually took the time to read your post and wanted to reply.
In my opinion, Kyro did nothing but try and help you.

Reply #10 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Its pretty obvious Kyro your quite new to both rational thought and the 4x Genre, so ill take a few moments out of my day to help you out.

If there is anyone that does not understand how bases work, take a long look in a mirror. No 4x game has ever made static bases or planetary defences truly effective, or even moderatley effective. Galciv is no exception-got that? Weither you like it not, Milbases are not particularly effective, nor do they act in a manner consistent with what one would expect of a civilization expending resources to make such structures. The comments I make are of a conceptual nature, not how things 'are' right now. I can see conceptulization is not a skill you possess to any great degree. Honestly, I dont really care about internal though processes, or lack there-off.

Infulence isnt a border? WOW REALLY? Thanks for the info. Once again you astounding ability to comprehend basic concepts and even english is nothing short of....well...nothing. I cant be bothered to explain the concept of borders, and territory for you. Please look them up in a dictionary. As for the concept of influence goes, thats an abstraction in Galciv as well as the real world. If you want a grown-up real world example, countries have 'influence' over others, some greater than others..some less. And it manifests itself in differrent ways in varying degrees as well. Yet the concept of 'territorial integrity' is something is something totally different from 'influence' such as this game defines it. And yes I think the idea should have been in-corporated into the game in some manner, if you dont like that thought expressed(of which you were not the intended recipient of in any event) ..too bad.

Thanks for playing kid.....


*cough* Idiot *cough*

Now go play on the motorway.
Reply #11 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Military starbases I'm not so hot on. They do seem to take a lot of work for a marginal impact in war faring capability. Their game mechanics, effective or not, are their mechanics. Would like to see them do more than just increase your hitpoints in their area of effectiveness. But, you don't *have* to build them, so I don't.


Not that I use them terribly often either, but have they changed starbases in 1.2? They did much more than just increased your hitpoints in their area of effectiveness last I checked. In fact, I don't recall them doing anything to hitpoints, just adding to offense/defense as you put modules on them. Sure, in theory, you could put a starbase in each sector near all your planets, build it up, and then any ships you positioned near those planets for defense would have pretty beefy damage/defense. *shrug* I just find it more fun to build bigger ships and get better logistics, so I can have large fleets of bigger ships.