Your specialized ships?

You know I never understood what the game ment by "specialized ships".

other than the usual colonizers, constructors, and freighters, sometimes when needed I create specialized pirate killer ships.

For the pirate killer ships, I use the largest hull I have (usually Huge hull), smack on the appropriate attack and defense depending on the pirate fleet stats. Then I create a few of them, maybe 5, enough to make a small fleet, and send them at the pirates. These ships are a highly specialized class, used only for eliminating pirate fleets, and they are very powerful, just one of them is capable of destroying or at least crippling the fleet for my next one to finish off. I don't use these for anything else and once the pirates are dead I either decommission them or upgrade them into constructors (if they are huge hulls).

Even though I'll let the pirates do thier own thing if they appear in enemy territory as they will make a dent in the other civ's militaries, however if they are either in my territory, attacking my trade routes, or just plain in the way, I destroy the bastards.

also, I have created a modified version of the colonizers in a few games which are essentially civillian transports or cruise ships. I got the idea from somewhere on the forums, I forget where, but they are a late game thing and are great for shuttling population from a high pop planet to a low population one, especially when you get that newly habitable planet UP thing.

You know I never understood what the game ment by "specialized ships".

you'd think it meant things like constructors, but no idea.

here we mean something specialized as in other than the usual constructors, colonizers, and freighters, ships that are meant to have a specific function and do nothing else. I gave a good example of a specialized ship.

I used to, but now I don't. The only specialisation I do apart from vigilantly keeping an eye on whomever I'm fighting or planning to fight and upgrading my fleet regularly is a few survey ships at the start. I like to keep my fleet list as simple as possible. Sometimes I'll design a special class of extra-long range constructors to nab a distant resource I've spotted. Normally my ship list looks something like

$COLONY SHIP
$SURVEY DESIGN
$CONSTRUCTOR DESIGN
$SMALL MILITARY SHIP
$MEDIUM MILITARY SHIP
$LARGE MILITARY SHIP

I wish there were a way to disable ships from previous games showing up in my list. It's a pain to have to keep obseleting so many.

yea, I don't make very many specialized ships myself other than the usual colonizers, constructors, frieghters, and scouts. The Pirate Killer ships are one of the few and the cruise ship one I mentioned is just a variation of the normal colonizers since they still ferry people, just don't actually colonize and can be reused. The cruise ships could actually be thought of as civillian owned (or corporation owned, or whatever) ships.

I wish there were a way to disable ships from previous games showing up in my list. It's a pain to have to keep obseleting so many

Delete the design when you have finished with them instead of making them obsolete..

Since i just got the game yesterday i played it on normal and I noticed that my opponents had an Obsession with Defenders so I looked at my defenders stats and then decided to make an Anti Defender has lots of shields so the defenders weapons render usless against it and also it was armed with2 singularty drivers very effective when the enemy started raiding my outer planets which i hadnt got military to yet.

I sometimes build what I call "commando" ships. These ships have 3-4x the speed of my normal fleet but are lightly armed with no defense. They are designed to slip quickly into enemy territory to knock out undefended transport ships, constructors, starbases, and freighters and then to get out--all in the same turn.

This slows the enemy down in their attack and also starts killing his infrastructure so that he is easier to take down.

theres an easier way to deleate all the ships.

C:\Documents and Settings\...\My Documents\My Games\GalCiv2\ships

deleate all inside the folder vuala

The coreships give me a headache, so these are some of my custom ships

I build is a scout improved,increased speed and scanners in a cargo hull.

Then when I have survey modules I build a survey craft on a cargo hull so I can add more support modules for greater range.

I like defensive craft so I build large world protectors with the biggest hull I have at the time, these need no engine,support, or scanners. Just defensive options and weapons. This I call the GUNSTAR class.

I also like to make the M Falcon class of Freighters Large hulls with trade part, and the rest engines and a couple defensive options. Because of there speed the AI has a hard time killing them off.

Then there is my Kill Joy class, fast craft with all the scanner options and heavy weapons. This is just to hunt down freighters, constructors, and weakened ships

I don't see the point in building a sensor ship just research the Sensor techs and build the "Eyes of the Universe" which gives all your ships/bases the max sensor range of 15 parsecs.

Survey ships - very important in early game to grab those anomalies and explore.

I build these once I have researched Ion Drive and Sensor 1 (give you the survey module) and keep them upgraded as new range and engine tech are researched and adding a 1 attack weapon once I have room for it.

Constructors: I have several designs for these ships.

Short range: Just the constructor module use these for building starbases in the same system.

Long range: enough life support to give max range (some where around 8 pc) and as many engines as I can fit (it still slow) to go after those resources bases in out of the way places.

Fast Constructor: I usually start building these once I have Warp III or better and they usually do 30+ pc I also place a plasma III weapon on them. I have found this very useful chance encounters with transports, constructors, freighters, scouts, etc.

Raiders: For operations in the enemy rear areas - primary duties starbase, transport and freighter termination.

Large Hull: 1 weapon (Best you have), 5 parsec range, engines (at least 20 parsec speed) and the best defenses for your current opponent.

Transports:

Mega Transport: At least 4 advance troop modules and as many engines as will fit.

Used for High pop world you don't want to mass drive.

Its also useful in solving over population problems on your own worlds.

Combat transport: Small hull, 2 Hyperwarp III, 1 Advance Troop module, phaser V or better, fleet together 10 - 15 and not only don't they need and escort they will clear the target planet their selves.

Besides ships to accomidate utility componeants i never build specialized ships.

I just one ship per each class. Giving at least one of them a sensor, usually the largest.

Their really is not reason to have specialized ships. At all. Combat transports are a complete waste of money, just build regular transports and guard them. The only transports I use are whatever holds the most, also.

Also after every major speed breakthrough i redesign every ship. Especially the utility ships like transports.

Besides that the game doesn't really need specilization as far as ships are concerned, besides using weapons that your enemies have no defences against. Their isn't enough special componeants to warrent specialized designs.

I don't see the point in building a sensor ship just research the Sensor techs and build the "Eyes of the Universe" which gives all your ships/bases the max sensor range of 15 parsecs.

oh I didn't know that, or rather didn't notice it because by the time I get it, I usually have scout hulls with 15 sensor range.

and even though the 'Eyes of the Universe' does show where the ships are, it doesn't say what they are, and a sensor ship, especially a very fast one is useful because then you can gather intelligence on just what the enemy is using, in mid to late game, it also helps to look around before a war starts because the AI does occasionally use military bases in an attempt to look stronger than they really are.

Kanaric, you're right about there not bieng very many special components to warrant many specialized designs. Although sometimes you might create something thats specialized for a specific situation, like my pirate killer ships. However there is going to be a few new components in DA, one which we know of is the space truck thing which is for the asteroid fields, and there might be more, considering that there are several new hulls (at least 2 or 3 complete hull type sets I think) and a whole bunch of new jewlery.

That's why I'd love to see more depth in the weapon trees rather than just the rock-paper-scissors we have (although the current is a big improvement over GalCiv1).

Only a few games in, but I've built a couple single-use ship types:

-My version of the "Defender" has no engines, sensors, or life support, just appropriate defenses and weapons for the enemy of the moment. Inspired by the Drengin (my allies) surrendering their homeworld to me, with multiple enemy fleets inbound, and no time to get my own ships across the galaxy to defend it. They'll never go anywhere, but they carry more firepower than more mobile ships can.

-I built a single "base buster" variant of my current ship-of-the-line last game, to kill a particularly built-up starbase. Much heavier shielding than on my standard model, and a bit slower and shorter-ranged. Higher "threat" rating to attract fire, and able to survive the heavy weaponry on the base, which would have chewed through several of my normal ships.

I like the option to specialize as needed. Sometimes, you run into something like the uber-beam starbase of DOOM!!, and rather than throw waves of your own ships at its unyielding hull, a little time in the shipyard can yield a more practical solution.

(Citizen)KanaricAugust 11, 2006 17:27:54Reply #12Besides ships to accommodate utility components i never build specialized ships. At all. Combat transports are a complete waste of money, just build regular transports and guard them. The only transports I use are whatever holds the most, also.

Every game will present different situations that call for different strategies. The combat transport I use in some games and not others, and when I build them cost is not a factor especially since a small hull and cargo hull cost the same.

In games where I've used them escorting transports was not enough due to logistics and fire power and only the fact that the transport were armed and had 9 HP instead of the cargo hull 1 HP allowed them to survive and reach their intended target.

You should try some different strats who knows you might finish a game in less then 9 - 18 years

Combat transports? Using the same ship for fighting and invasions is seriously inefficient. A fleet of combat transports is less effective at space combat than a fleet of dedicated warships because the combat transports have to carry troop modules in place of some weapons or defenses. This means that even if the fleet of combat transports wins a battle, it will have lost more ships than a true combat fleet would have. And when a combat transport gets destroyed in space combat, then you lose the soldiers it was carrying.

Each combat transport carries fewer troops than a dedicated transport. So when the fleet of combat transports invades a planet, it may have to use up more ships. And every combat transport costs more than a regular transport because it's loaded with weapons and defenses. In both roles, you're paying more for a ship that is less effective than either a specialized combat ship or transport. You're better off building a strong, reusable combat fleet, and cheap, fast, expendable transports.

Here are some designs I think are good ideas:

- Stellar Flyby. This is sometimes the first ship I build in a game. It's a cargo hull with some life supports, and the rest of the hull is filled with engines. Its purpose is to fly to each star on the map and check for habitable planets in advance of my colony ships. Once that's done, it contacts the aliens and explores their planets.

- Sensor Ship. It's a cargo hull with lots of sensors and just enough engines to outrun enemies. Building a few of these is a lot cheaper than researching and building the Eyes of the Universe.

- Assassin. It's similar to the system flyby, but it has one small gun. Use it for destroying unarmed enemies like transports, freighters, and defenseless starbases. It often works in conjunction with a sensor ship.

- The Deterrent. Biggest hull + all weapons. Put it on a planet with the Spin control center.

- Juggernaut. Take your largest combat hull, load it with strong defenses against your chosen enemy, add enough engines for decent speed, and top it off with a few weapons. A fleet of juggernauts is the best way to destroy fleets of smaller ships. This is because their heavy defenses activate every time the smaller, more numerous ships fire. Juggernauts are particularly useful when you have a tech advantage to minimize attrition.

- Heavy Assault. Heavy assault ships are the counter to juggernauts, even if your military tech is behind your enemy's. Use a big hull, but it's okay if it's smaller than the enemy juggernaut. Use enough engines to intercept the enemy, no defense, and as many weapons as possible. Of course, use weapons that beat their defense if at all possible, but it's not actually required. With your big weapons versus their big defense, you'll do zero damage with some shots, and lots of damage with other shots. Heavy assault fleets usually take significant damage when they win, but they're cheaper to build than juggernauts.

- Swarm Fighters. These are the answer to heavy assault ships. A swarm fighter is a tiny hull with strong weapons and no defense. They win because they cause the heavy assault ships to waste their firepower destroying the fighters one at a time. 100 attack is complete overkill when shooting at a ship with 6 hitpoints. Meanwhile, the swarmers do full damage to the assault ships that have little or no defenses. Fleets of swarm fighters obviously suffer lots of attrition, but they make the best use of military starbases' ship assist modules. Finally, swarm fighters are useless against juggernauts.

I often build extremely long-range and fast freighters, and occasionally slap a few sensor upgrades on 'em, so they can do a little recon on their way to the targetted trade planet...but I like the OP's idea, I think I'll give it a try next game.

Citizen)nullspaceAugust 12, 2006 14:28:45Reply #17Combat transports? Using the same ship for fighting and invasions is seriously inefficient. A fleet of combat transports is less effective at space combat than a fleet of dedicated warships because the combat transports have to carry troop modules in place of some weapons or defenses. This means that even if the fleet of combat transports wins a battle, it will have lost more ships than a true combat fleet would have. And when a combat transport gets destroyed in space combat, then you lose the soldiers it was carrying. Each combat transport carries fewer troops than a dedicated transport. So when the fleet of combat transports invades a planet, it may have to use up more ships. And every combat transport costs more than a regular transport because it's loaded with weapons and defenses. In both roles, you're paying more for a ship that is less effective than either a specialized combat ship or transport. You're better off building a strong, reusable combat fleet, and cheap, fast, expendable transports.

In my current game I was at war with the Arceans and had destroyed their main fleets when the Torians attacked followed by the Dregin.

So this required the fleets that I would use to clear off planets and keep them clear were required on the other side of map to meet this dual attack.

I didn't have the capacity to supply military and transport ship for all 3 wars there for I took a small hull (same cost as cargo) I advance troop module, 3 Hyperwarp III engines, 1 level 5 phaser. Built a fleet of 14 and sent them after the Arcean.

Results 9 high PQ planets to the loss of 1 CT in combat, my second fleet of 9 CT ships taking 7 more planets forcing the Arceans surrender to me.

Hardly inefficient.

Now lets talk cost or build time...

I was also building a high speed Transports for the Torain and Dregin fronts which consisted of a:

Fast Transport
Cargo Hull
2 advance troop modules
8 Hyperwarp III engines
on a world with 4 Industrial Zones
usual build time 5 - 10 weeks

Combat Transport
Small hull
1 advance troop module
1 level 5 phaser
3 Hyperwarp III engines
on a world with 4 Industrial Zones
usual build time 1 - 5 weeks

But as I said before they are not for every game

Sensor Ship. It's a cargo hull with lots of sensors and just enough engines to outrun enemies. Building a few of these is a lot cheaper than researching and building the Eyes of the Universe.

Eyes of the universe cost less then 6000 BC and gives every ship the MAX sensor range of 15 parsec.

Sensor ships are just a WASTE of MONEY.

Sensor ships are just a WASTE of MONEY.

It really depends. Eyes of the Universe might be cheap for a wonder, but that doesn't make them more cost-effective. Consider that a sensor ship can be built with low level tech for about a fortieth of the cost of an EOTU (~150bc).

Certainly the EOTU is nice to have, but if you can't or won't devote the manufacturing to one, then a handful of sensor ships can do much the same thing for a fraction of the cost.

Fast Colonly ships right at the start of the game. One colony module, max engines, support in leftover spots to planet rush at the start.

Fast Invasion ships; one troop module, max engines. When you get to warp III you can really invade fast once you wipe out the defending ships and clear a route.

Fast constructors: same thing, nothing like shooting across half the map and building starbases from zero to max in 2 or 3 turns.

Other then that, my ships are normally all 3 engines with the rest used by hull size:
Light hulls as escorts, no defenses, max weapons. Useful as fodder in fleet battles and as commerce/starbase raiders and scouts.
Small Hulls as heavy escort/planet and starbase defense, one defensive module, maxed weapons
Medium Hulls as capital ships until I get large hulls, with one weapon and maxxed out defense. Once I get large hulls I put 2 or 3 defense on them and max out weapons. I keep a few of the max defense ones as planed defense on important planets or starbases
Large hulls, same as medium, except I dont use them as defense, they are always with a fleet.
Huge hulls: 50/50 defense/offense, used as capital ships in fleets.

I keep all my fleet ships with 3 engines, that keeps them all together. I slap life support on leftover hull spots. On medium or large hulls I use sensors until I get Eyes of the Universe.

I use a cargo hull in the begining to build a scout that has only one hit point, but that can be crammed with engines, sensors, and life support. It is much faster and farther ranged than a scout using small or tiny hulls, and it doesn't have a maintainance cost associated with the design. This compares favorably with the default "scout" in the game, and the benifits are magnified as the game progresses and the engines and sensor packs become more powerful. Try having five warp engines on your scout rather than one!

Sometimes I make fast ranged ships at the start and upgrade them when they reach their destination when I'm trying to rush for the planets.

I can only hope that one day Frogboy will add Sensors that affect combat and give us some other combat options. I love creating specialized ships but there's not much that you can do with the limits of this game.

Wish List ....

Sensors affecting Combat
Cloaked Ships
Fighters and Carriers
Mine Sweepers and Mine Layers (as well as detectors)
Star Gates

Mostly now, I just stick to five kinds of ships.
(1) Scouts - unarmed, fast, no defense, good support (later in the game I arm them)
(2) Survey Vessels - Larger Hull than scouts but with Survey Module
(3) Orbital Sentries - All weapons and Defense, no Drive or support
(4) Line Ships - Balanced Warships
(5) Fighters - Lightly armed, min defense and very fast for killing unarmed ships.

How do they carry a population, deposit them on a planet and then get reused? Once you colonize, that's it. So how do you load people onto it?