Ship configurations and ship protection

If I'm equally advanced in the weapons techs (can only happen if I've captured a tech as I stick to researching on one branch usually) I use a mixture as it is harder to defend against. Otherwise it is just the biggest bang per buck. This is usually guns as the cost of weapons on that branch is lower than the others.

The formula for defence is based on the full value of the specific defence + Square root of the other two. (E.g. If you have 1 point in each then the defence is 3 against all types of attack. If you have 4 points in each then you have 8 points of defence against all types of attack.)

the "wrong" type of defence achieves a square root of its proper defencive value. Interestingly as someone pointed out the square root of 1 is 1.

I think you must always play it by ear. Look at what your enemies are using and research and build appropriatly praying that the all use the same stuff hehe.

The wrong defense is still a bit effective against any of the weapon types. It is calculated on its square root value, so you might get as much as 3 defense if you have say, 9 shield defense against mass drivers.

Also, consider what some of the 'special' ships are outfitted with.
The Lucky Ranger, one tough ship to kill, has only mass drivers and armor. But it still stands up pretty well to beams and missles.

In one recent battle of mine, I had outfitted a ship with very heavy armor only. The only weapons used so far in the game had been mass drivers. I was surprised to find some Yor fleets outfitted with some heavy missles when I attacked them. But those armor only ships fared very well. I did not lose a single one, even though the odds were around 7-1 with a few of the fleets. And this was in v1.2 beta with the new combat system.

I think in my next game I will test it out a bit further and only use armor only like the Rangers.

One advantage, if they survive long enough to take some damage and effect repairs, is that the hit points can get insanely high. Once the hit points are high enough it is nearly impossible to do enough damage to destroy them. If the defenses are so good that they take zero damage the experience does not count for as much, and the hit points don't climb as fast.

I maximize weapons on ships.... to use up all the space... I hate wasted space on ships....

"I maximize weapons on ships.... to use up all the space... I hate wasted space on ships.... "

But then you also waste a lot of ships.
I tend to build ships that use defensive tech against the weapons the other races built to a certain degree while putting weapons in em that the enemy has no or little defense against.
Even if my weapons are not as advanced the additional defense usually keeps em alive long enough to finish off the enemy ships.

"The Lucky Ranger, one tough ship to kill, has only mass drivers and armor. But it still stands up pretty well to beams and missles."

HUH?! In the few cases I ever met a Ranger it was a piss pot with next to no defe or offence at all...

Sub-optimal defenses provide square root (rounded down) defense so for example shields 8 provides sqrt(8)=2 defense against missiles and mass drivers.

It is best to only use one type of weapon on your ships for two reasons:
(1) Each weapon type is fired separately against the enemies defenses (i.e., say you have beam 9 and missiles 9 against shields 9, then it will be beam 9 against shields 9 and missiles 9 against shields sqrt(9)=3 vs. beam 18 against sheilds 9)
(2) By focusing on one weapon type you can advance to high tech weapons faster

With the current first strike advantage (attacker shoots first) it makes sense to focus on attack strength and speed. You don't need defenses if you can take out the enemy before he can fire back. Also, as your ships gain experience they will gain hit points making them better able to survive a counter attack if some of the enemy fleet survives your first strike to fire back.

In v1.2 the first strike advantage goes away so then defenses will become much more important!

I chose quality over quantity.
In the beginning I just build one tiny fighter with only weapons and no defense or engines for each planet to stay in orbit. That way it looks like I have some millitary power and the AI can't use only troop transports for an invasion. Then depending of what's happening around me one or two squads of fast small fighters to intercept hostile freighters, troop transprts and constructors. But most of the time I research/trade up to Medium Scale Building and build frigates with at least one engine of the most advanced type. I keep an eye on possible agressors and what weapons they are researching. Then I add a defence of 2-4 (against the opponents weapons choice) and I go for one specific weapon type (again based on what everbody else is doing and choosing something different, of course).
I always try to research to the last tech of one tier (weapons/defense/engines) and/or the first of the next. This gives the most flexibility regarding the us eof space on my ships.
Normally I am able to build those right about the time the AI declares war on me.
Then I build squads consisting of these frigates and most of the time I don't fill up "left over" logistic points. Only if there is a tiny or small fighter at hand. Then it's time of guarding planets is over and he has to fulfill his destiny to fight fleets of superior ships and die for the glory his nation.
At least in the new combat system he gets to fire a shot before going to valhalla...

Oh, and after that I chose "Quantitiy". I prefer using only "more" frigates compared to "lesser" battleships in a squad. I take some time to research Large Scale Building. I focus on logistics.

I uselly put ECM III, the best 1 def armor, and the best 1 def shield. Than all room is wepons and a Imp drive III

It's been shown repeatedly that defense isn't worth having. Go all offense all the time. HPs just don't scale up enough to make it worthwhile mid to late game, so why waste the research.

Well for me ship design is part of it. On the whole I usally run just behind the curve on weapons tech. So speed.important along with fleet size. Usally till I have rebounders. If I can hit a fleet first before they hit me then I usally wind or there on the ropes and my follow up fleet takes them out easily. Usally I go with guns or missles. I usally do missles if I have have alot of success stealing tech from the enemy. For me at least two engines and one or two weaqpons. Miniturzation is the key espically with a fighter based offence in early game. My first successful fighters usally come with one warp and one impulse drive.

Military star bases. my constructor corp is probably the most offensive unit. Still all and all I win games with a military ranked number two even after the enemy has lost half there empire.

Why are the Yor so bad? My pics for my race are alsways geared toward production and luck the Yor are usally also rans when I have a good game.

Duh.

It's been shown repeatedly that defense isn't worth having.

Oh, "the-defenses-are-worthless" thread again. (See also: https://forums.galciv2.com/?ForumID=346&AID=117458)

I tend to use a lot of defenses (matching whatever my worst enemy has) as soon as I have medium hulls, but not before that. Putting defenses on a tiny or small ship means it will either be slow or a weak attacker.

i use lots of defense only on my transports and then 1 of each on other ships if i have room

the last game i played i had 40+ defense on everything the ai did not like my transports

I'm curious what ship mixtures you folks use.

So far, I've tended to use the following ship types:

a) Warship - ships with whatever size hull I can manage with the best mix of weapons and defenses I can afford (I do like to use defenses to a degree).
Sensor Ship - a tiny hull, built to match the speed and range of my warships but loaded with sensors and no weapons. Using this ship gives me a decent sensor range in a fleet without having to build sensors into my other designs (and it only costs my fleets two logistics points). So far, I've found this approach is worth it since seeing what's coming at you is half the battle (then it's often your choice whether to attack or to run).
c) Interceptor - a tiny hull loaded with as many engines as it will take and light weaponry. I use small groups of these ships for attacking freighters and unescorted transports during wartime (their good speed usually allows them to escape from better combat craft and generally stay out of trouble).
d) Sensor Interceptor - Sensor ship (see b above) for escorting interceptors.

Obviously there are transports and colony ships too, but the above are my primary ship types.

Mid game: 40% space to engines, 10% to a 1 pt defense, the rest weapons. Sometimes more specialized ships are useful, but the fast hard hitting offense ships are always the mainstay. Transports usually faster than military ships. Constructors and freighters vary depending on how long extra it takes to make a faster, more expensive versions.

Cheaper is better and that means very little defense and lots of engines. Bigger hulls are just as good as high tech defense without the research costs. The increase in hitpoints is equivalent to the high cost defense modules.

Some special ships that are useful include the tiny troop transport, the small scout with one cheap weapon that is 50% faster than the fast military ships, heavy ships with fewer engines for a short haul to a particularly nasty fight. The first "heavy" ship might be a small ship with three lasers and no engine, a bit more punch than a two laser, one engine impulse ship. I don't build many of these, but a few of them often prove very useful when a little extra punch is needed.

Yeah Tiger I love my Small hull based troop transport near the end of the game with three troop modules my fav troop transport.

Except in special situations, such as a much weaker enemy that I can put enough defense on to completely negate his attack or if I'm using military starbases, none of my ships get defense. Given the current comabt engine, they don't make sense.

It's probably because I go incredibly diplomatic and research races, but I never seem to be behind the curve or even attacked until I'm prepared with large hulled ships capable of defeating entire fleets of what the enemy has. I usually research the final defensive techs and have them implemented before I ever have war declared on me. And I also go for two weapon researches. The reason? Simple, I think beam weapons look best, so they're always researched, and Missiles look cool firing simultaneously to Phasers on capital class ships.
My tiny hulled ships always have lasers, they're the escorts of the fleet
The small hulled ships always have missiles. I just love having a 'bomber' class.
Medium focuses on lasers
Large and huge have a mix.

Partly I justify it by saying that they never have the appropriate defenses for both weapon types (and sometimes waste space on their ships putting in defenses for both types), but the real reason is I just think it looks awesome.

Thanks for your input everyone. Particularly on square root defense.

I usually stick no defense on the tiny hulls, 1 on small hulls, 2 on medium, 3 on large, and up to 4 or 5 on huge hulls. I find this keeps my tiny ships first in line to get attacked, and they're easy to replace in fleets. I'll defend large ships because I'd prefer not to replace them. also, since the most powerfull attacker in a fleet is first targeted, if a fight is going badly, the AI's most powerful attackers will be destroyed by the time anything is shooting at my larger ships, and they can mop up the AI fleet while most of the attacks on them do no damage or a few hitpoints at best since the AI's heavy hitter ship has already been destroyed.

usually I go with 30% hull space for weapons... and 70% for engines (which i research to the max early in the game) .. then make fleets... you end up with fleets that move at 20+ pc/wk.... and dish out enought damage to kill any enemy ship with a single hit (thus no need to waste space on defence as they never hit you)...

With the modification of everyone shooting at once combat will change drastically and defences will actually be worth having (probably... defence is STILL more expensive then weapons, I can put that shield on, or an extra two guns to overwhelm opponenets shield... mmm)

"I maximize weapons on ships.... to use up all the space... I hate wasted space on ships.... " But then you also waste a lot of ships. I tend to build ships that use defensive tech against the weapons the other races built to a certain degree while putting weapons in em that the enemy has no or little defense against. Even if my weapons are not as advanced the additional defense usually keeps em alive long enough to finish off the enemy ships. "The Lucky Ranger, one tough ship to kill, has only mass drivers and armor. But it still stands up pretty well to beams and missles." HUH?! In the few cases I ever met a Ranger it was a piss pot with next to no defe or offence at all...

I have not seen one show up in a very long time. And the last few times were when the weapons research had far surpassed them so I gave them away to minor races. So I know what you mean. In 1.0 they showed up much earlier in the game and gave a huge advantage, especially if you scored 4-6 of them.

I also make ships with defenses to match the most likely I will go to war with, and weapons that they don't have any defenses for. They are getting better in 1.2 at building the next round with those defenses now. So it gets harder to catch them unawares after that first strike.

I'll usually have around a 2//3 to 1/3 ratio of defense and weapons. With the new combat model in 1.2 it is a lot harder to keep all the ships intact during that first and second round of the battle. I usually have much fewer ships in my fleets, but they are more powerful. So sometimes it is 13 against my 3. And the ships are so costly (both time and money get real short early in a war) that I can't afford to lose any of them if I can help it.

right in the beginning i just build some basic defenders - cargo hulls with basic weps

i usually diplo till mid game to keep everyone happy and off my back

I concentrate on speed initially, +1 racial ability, accelerators, shipyards, and 3 engines per ship = ~24 pc/turn

small ships for light production planets, 3 engines, 1 def, max weps
med ships for most planets, 3 engines, 2 or 3 defense, max weps
huge ships for heavy prodcution, 3 engines, equal defense and weapons - match def to next target.

I usually don't bother upgrading, just use the mismatched armor ships as fodder as its so expensive to swap a bunch of armor on a huge ship. They still do alright though, although a bit more attrition.

If I'm able to keep everyone diplo'd I pick a target, build my fleets (usually 1 full fleet per 2 enemy planets), fleets have 3 or 4 transports each. Park my fleets next to their planets, attack and usually wipe out a civilization in 1 or two turns and their fleets disappear.

In a non best case scenario I keep my highly mobile fleets (no transports) to chase em down, then move everything in a line to make sure nothing gets by.