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Answers to questions about the Metaverse

how scoring works and more

By on June 29, 2006 2:48:36 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

CariElf

Join Date 08/2001
+54

Metaverse Question # 1: How does scoring work?

    The general forumula is SumOfDepreciatedScores / NumberOfGames^4

    Scores deprecate by 5% every 30 days with the maximum depreciate being 65% at 290 days or more.

Metaverse Question # 2: What is the status of the score re-calculation?
 
     Rankings are updated twice a day and a player's score is updated when a new game is submitted.  There was a bug that caused some scores to fail in the middle of updating, but that is being fixed.
 
Metaverse Question # 3:  Error 12 (serial does not match) - what is this and how can I fix it? 
 
     This is generally caused after updating or a re-install.  You probably mistyped your serial number, or left out a character, etc.  You won't be able to fix the save game, unfortunately, and I can't submit games or scores for you.
 
Metaverse Question # 4:  Error 16 (Please try again later) - Huh? I'm connected to the internet, I have the Skip Internet Check option ON, my anti-virus/security program/firewall is configured to allow GC2 to submit to the metaverse and I keep getting this error.  What gives?!
 
    This is a general error returned by the metaverse that GC2 doesn't recognize and doesn't know how to handle.  These errors were supposed to be logged so that they could be fixed, but a few of them were overlooked.   The guys who handle the web end of the metaverse have added additional logging code and will be monitoring the logs to try and fix these errors.  If, after repeated attempts, you can't submit the game, go into My Documents\My Games\GalCiv2 and rename the Endgamesave.sav file.  You can also create another subfolder and move end game saves there, and the load game dialog will still be able to load them.  This will let you try again later without worrying about overwriting your game.
  
Metaverse Question # 5: What causes the cheating flag to be tripped?
 
    Modifying data or finishing the game in 12 turns or less, even if you used legitimate means to finish the game.  Also, if you somehow end up with negative ability bonus points when customizing your race, that will set the cheating flag if you start the game with that race.  For 1.3 (starting with the third beta) I am adding a message box to warn if you have an invalid race config so that you can fix it before starting a game that will be flagged as invalid. Also, if we change the metaverse data for the races or the starting abilities, you will get this warning if you are using the old data.  If you are warned that you have an invalid race config, use the Clear button to reset to the default race configuration, and then make whatever changes you want.

Metaverse Question # 6: Why can't I use mods with the metaverse?
 
    Because mods can give you an unfair advantage over people submitting without mods, and not everyone wants to use mods. Anything we did to try to equalize a game using mods in the metaverse would just make more people unhappy. Also, mods can have unexpected effects on the code, because they ARE modifications.  For example, in GC1/AP, someone made a custom map with over 1000 planets and it caused the game to crash as soon as the 1000th (or higher) planet was colonized, because the max number of colonies was 1000.  It was a bug, but it wasn't one that would have shown up in an unmodded game, which always had far less than 1000 planets.
 
   If you want to compete with mods, talk to one of the fansites' webmasters about setting up a contest where everyone uses the same mods and agrees to play under set conditions.  Then you can post the results and discuss your different strategies. 

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November 26, 2008 1:03:09 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

1.  You can get your medals under your post by going to the Metaverse link in the top left of this page, click on Account, and then Edit My Characters, and over onthe right there should be a darkened button that says 'Default'.  click that for the character you wish the medals to display.  Note, medals won't show on original posts, but any replies they will show up.

2.  The little thumbs up icon under somebodies post will bring up a pop-up window to give karma to them.  At one point you could gain forum 'levels' and thus the ability to give more than 1 point of karma to someone if you were beyond level 1 (default).  Reasons for giving karma...whatever you wish.  I think the original purpose was for useful/helpful responses.

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January 9, 2009 1:14:44 AM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

Dear 

Hello 

I read this post and I am still confused about how scoring is done. Has this scoring been updated for v2.2.

Maybe someone help do the math on my 3 scores I submited:

first game: 47,600

second game 48,600

third game 58,450

total MV score 94,839 not my math 154,350

( lost 59,511 points )

I just want to how this is done so I can keep  on playing.

 

 

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January 9, 2009 6:58:24 AM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

As each game gets submitted, it is worth less and less points by percentage.  Only your first game is worth 100% of what it was submitted as.

Also, over time the game is worth less and less points.  My character Loupdinour once held around 900,000 points, now I'm down to 680,000 since I haven't touched a MV game with him since July.

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January 9, 2009 9:02:05 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

47600 * 0.90 = 42840
48300 * 0.95 = 45885
58450 * 1.00 = 58450

Total = 147175

147175/ 3 ^ 0.4 (typo in OP) = 94838

(Edit: Thanks Mumble for making me realize that I mistyped one of the scores, as I was relying on the original post.)

-

I may just be nitpicking, but there's been enough discussion on the topic previously about how "important" your first game is that I thought I'd attempt to address any remaining confusion.

As a correction to Loup's post:

Your first game is not worth 100%.  Your first game is worth 100% because it is your only game.  Your second game makes both your first and second games each worth approximately 75.78% (x / 2 ^ 0.4).  Rinse and repeat.  The important part here is that as you play more and more games, each one of them is worth less to your total score.

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January 9, 2009 9:22:43 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

Maybe someone help do the math on my 3 scores I submited:

first game: 47,600

second game 48,600

third game 58,450
Well it depends on how old the games are. But I'll show you how it''s done.

Scores deprecate by 5% every 30 days with the maximum depreciate being 65% at 290 days or more.
First you have to depreciate the games based on how old they are. In your case the 58,450 game is new and therefore full value. The 48,300 game is 30 days old and depreciates by 5% so is worth 48,300 x 0.95 = 45,885. The 47,600 game is 60 days old and and depreciates by 10% so is worth 47,600 x 0.90 = 42,840. So the SumOfDepreciatedScores is 58,450 + 45,885 + 42,840 = 147,175.

The general forumula is SumOfDepreciatedScores / NumberOfGames^4
There's a typo in this formula, it should be ^0.4. Note that the ^ indicates the power function so X^2 is X squared and X^0.5 is the square root of X. Here ^0.4 is somewhat less than the square root.

Anyway the number of games is 3 and 3^0.4 (three to the 0.4 root) is 1.5518... so your total score (at least until one of your games ages a bit more is 147,175/1.5518... = 94,838.689... surprisingly this rounds up to your actual score of 94,839 which is rare for Stardock math. Note that I carried the full significance of calculator throughout the calculation so I'm sure there's some truncation going on I'm just not sure at what point it occurs (not that it matters much). 

[edit] I started this and in the middle of it the wife called me for dinner which in my house is a level 0 interrupt. I didn't even notice that SoleSoul had already answered when I got back to press submit, but the follow on info in the next reply is still interesting. SoleSoul's discrepancy is because GmOOnii's 2nd game is actually 48,300 not 48,600 but close enough. [/edit]

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January 9, 2009 9:53:38 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

Your second game makes both your first and second games each worth approximately 75.78%
This is of course true however it's not really how most people tend to think about it.

Basically you have a current MV score and you play another game and get X points for it and what you really want to know is what your new score will be. While it is true that you've devalued *all* scores by the same amount there is a more intuitive way to look at it.

Your current MV score (i.e. the MV score with n games submitted) is:

MV = (sum of n games)/n^0.4

Now let NS be the score of your new game (i.e. the n+1 game). So you new MV score (NMV) is:

NMV = (sum of n+1 games)/(n+1)^0.4 = MV*(n^0.4)/(n+1)^0.4 + NS/(n+1)^0.4

Breaking this down gives the following data.

n

Old MV Score

New Game

 
 

1

75.80%

75.80%

 

2

85.00%

64.40%

 

3

89.10%

57.40%

 

4

91.50%

52.50%

 

5

93.00%

48.80%

 

6

94.00%

45.90%

 

7

94.80%

43.50%

 

8

95.40%

41.50%

 

9

95.90%

39.80%

 

10

96.30%

38.30%

 

11

96.60%

37.00%

 

12

96.80%

35.80%

 

13

97.10%

34.80%

 

14

97.30%

33.90%

 

15

97.50%

33.00%

 

16

97.60%

32.20%

 

17

97.70%

31.50%

 

18

97.90%

30.80%

 

19

98.00%

30.20%

 

20

98.10%

29.60%

 

21

98.20%

29.00%

 

22

98.20%

28.50%

 

23

98.30%

28.00%

 

24

98.40%

27.60%

 

25

98.40%

27.20%

 

26

98.50%

26.80%

 

27

98.60%

26.40%

 

28

98.60%

26.00%

 

29

98.70%

25.70%

 

30

98.70%

25.30%

 

31

98.70%

25.00%

 

32

98.80%

24.70%

 

33

98.80%

24.40%

 

34

98.80%

24.10%

 

35

98.90%

23.80%

 

36

98.90%

23.60%

 

37

98.90%

23.30%

 

38

99.00%

23.10%

 

39

99.00%

22.90%

 

40

99.00%

22.60%

 

41

99.00%

22.40%

 

42

99.10%

22.20%

 

43

99.10%

22.00%

 

44

99.10%

21.80%

 

45

99.10%

21.60%

 

46

99.10%

21.40%

 

47

99.20%

21.30%

 

48

99.20%

21.10%

 

49

99.20%

20.90%

 

50

99.20%

20.70%

 

At any point if you have n games and you submit a new game then you depreciate your current MV score by the vaule in the Old Score column and the add the percentage value for the new game. Note that for the 2nd game you get precisely as SoleSoul said. But the point of this is that as you add more and more games that depreciates your old score less and less but at the same time you get less and less "credit" for any new scores.

After awhile you can ignore the old score depreciation and just consider that you're getting 25% "credit" (for example) for a new score (at n equals 31).

Note that for the next game you submit with your current character n=3 so your current MV score will depreciate by about 9% and you will get approximately 50% credit for the next game. Of course if another 30 days go by then your old games will have depreciated by another 5% but this gets you in the ballpark of what to expect.

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January 9, 2009 10:31:09 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

All that being said- you, if you are part of an empire that is on the AltMeta, will get full credit for each and every game when they are submitted. But only active players/games are tracked, as they depriciate by IIRC ~15% each month (so 0pts after 6 months).

In other words: the Metaverse will give you stats on LONG term players/games since the inception of the MV, while the AltMeta will give you stats on all CURRENT/ACTIVE games/empires/players.

The AltMeta can be found here: www.altmeta.kryofx.com

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January 9, 2009 10:34:14 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

This is of course true however it's not really how most people tend to think about it.

I'm not most people. 

Edited above and thanks for pointing out my mistake. 

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January 9, 2009 11:23:50 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

I'm not most people.
Obviously.

However the point of my method is that it's an incremental approach. In other words people know what their current MV score is and don't really care so much about how it came to be. What they do want to know is what effect does a new game have on their current MV score. That's how the data in my table is organized.

Again it's still all the same numbers, it's just a slightly different way to look at it.

In other words: the Metaverse will give you stats on LONG term players/games since the inception of the MV, while the AltMeta will give you stats on all CURRENT/ACTIVE games/empires/players.
Excellent point. Both the MV and the AltMeta give useful but different data although the AltMeta also includes some longterm data in the All Time categories as well.

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January 10, 2009 4:23:58 AM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

Dear 

Hello

First, I want to thank you all for making me less confused and on that note, I will look at how my submited scores effects my empire score and not the math behind it because it makes me sad.   So are the Top Ten Empires are losing points every month too?

Second, I like know where is my empire Adepta Soroitas?  I think it is in MV but is in AltMeta too. How do I find out? May I have my empire Adepta Soroitas in both MV and AltMeta?  Where is  AltMeta?

 

Order of the Bloody Rose of Orders Militant of Adepta Sororitas

Saint Mina of Opelia VII

 

 

 

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January 10, 2009 5:13:49 AM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

So are the Top Ten Empires are losing points every month too?
Yes, everyone plays by the same rules. The MV scores depreciate to 65% but then stays forever. In the Altmeta scores depreciate by 1/6th (16.67%) each month and so in 6 months a game no longer counts for anything, however all depreciated scores are added without dividing them by some function of games submitted. This is what Silver mentioned that the MV is a more permanent score and the AltMeta is more a score of recent activity. The point about not dividing by number of games is that it doesn't penalize someone that plays lots of small games versus someone that plays a few big games.

Anyway the AltMeta is at http://altmeta.kryofx.com/.

Basically the Altmeta gets it's data via RSS feeds from the MV and to get in the AltMeta Kryo needs to put you on a list of empires to be updated.

You can get help for the AltMeta at the AltMeta Help Desk which is a sticky thread under the Metaverse forum. I took the liberty of requesting that your empire, Adepta Sororitas, be added to the list. It might take a couple of days but you should be all set. If not check back in the AltMeta Help Desk thread.

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January 10, 2009 1:35:34 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

Dear

Hello

@ Mumblefratz again   thank you

In this I am playing, the purple team you know the Thalans wanted to make peace so bad they gave me 5 PQ 16 plantes (no buildings) all in the corner of the map and now this was just after a Mega Event all planets ( I think it was 8 or 9 planets) within 2 pcs of a certain plantet become PQ 12 but when I got them jump to PQ 16 because of transforming. Now I have a close group of planets that are PQ 16s.

Order of the Bloody Rose of Orders Militant of Adepta Sororitas

Saint Mina of Opelia VII

 

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January 10, 2009 1:42:29 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

thank you
You're welcome.

the Thalans wanted to make peace so bad they gave me 5 PQ 16 plantes (no buildings) all in the corner of the map
Free planets are nice.

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January 10, 2009 2:12:13 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

Hello

I went to work on them too,  I made three shipyards and six money makers planets with troopers breeders  lol      If they get low on morale, off they go in a AUX-Trooper-Mo -(Marine Transport) 5,000 of them at a time.

Saint Mina of Opelia VII

 

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July 1, 2009 3:43:29 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

Sorry to ask this question but here goes anyway. I have posted 2 scores which show but my empire score remains 0, how does this work?

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July 1, 2009 4:11:15 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

According to your Metaverse profile, you're not a member of your empire.  Actually, there appear to be no members.  You should be able to log into the Metaverse, look up your empire and join it.  The games should then show up after the next Metaverse update.

In theory.

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July 6, 2009 2:12:06 AM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

thanks

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October 19, 2009 5:37:46 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

I tried to post my first MV with GC2 but it constantly refused to send the data.

Got a (11) error message (serial doesn´t match the one on the MV server) which I don´t understand cause the serial is 100% the same and I re-validated and re-registered many times.

I took Impulse to update it; then I got the (16) error message(s).

I removed the .sav file, but that brought me back to the (11) error message. Backchecked the serial, well still fine.

Don´t know what to do now, but maybe it was a bad idea to update during the game.

Did anybody else have this trouble, and, is there somehow a way to test *before* I play a game if the MV server will accept my serial number?

 

thanks in advance

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October 19, 2009 9:18:58 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

Maiden666...I don't have a clue about the serial problem.  Start a game, retire and attempt a post.  Since you have no previous games posted there is no consequence to your character. 

 

 

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October 19, 2009 10:51:23 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

@Maiden: if you update an "active" game, most times it won't let you submit it later. There were a few patch exceptions long ago, but with GCII being pretty much in finished form, thats no longer the case.

Anyhow, do what Jack is suggesting- start a new MV game and retire, that will let you know if you're able to submit correctly.

If that doesn't work, open up a ticket to support.

Unfortunately, the game you had won't be any good. sorry

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October 31, 2009 10:49:49 AM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

I´ve noted that it´s required to enter a serial when creating a new player for MV. question is, is that player then bound to the game to which the serial belongs to?

I got both GalCiv2 DL from Paradox, and GalCiv2 Ultimate from Kalypso recently; question is if I will be able to play with the player created for DL in UE too?

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October 31, 2009 9:51:56 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

Anybody knows from experience here which is a safe date after which ZYW can be posted with DL 1.53 without toggling that nice cheat-flag?

I read different info´s here: 12th round, <15th round, after April 8th...

Will April 1st trigger a flag? It´s round 13... 

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November 8, 2009 7:58:29 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

Wait,

Why would they make a score get lower over time at all?

It's non-logical!

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November 9, 2009 10:28:38 AM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

Because an early win is more difficult to do, assuming one plays without going massively into dept or leases.

Oh, and if you mean the thing with score depreciation, I think it´s to give new players a slight advantage....

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November 9, 2009 3:40:58 PM from GalCiv II Forums GalCiv II Forums

Just to clear this up,

The person who started this forum said that the score cannot reach lower than 65% of the original, right?

So, assuming that you score 10,000 points on an MV game, it will never ever go below 6,500 points?

And also, does the difficulty of the game add a scoring multiplier?

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